A sociopath reader questions why sociopaths are seen as wolves:
Don't get me wrong, wolves are cool. If I could be any animal, it would be a predator. If I had to choose, my decision would be between an Alaskan Wolf and a Harpy Eagle. However, people actually looking at a sociopath as some type of predator disgusts me to the point of wanting to hurt the fucking idiots who label anyone as such. Now, I have no doubt that there are some people who actually are predators in some way. Some people may actually fit the bill. However, labeling a group of people as so is just ridiculous. When I meet someone, I don't look for their weaknesses and attack them for it. Knowing someone over a period of time, it is only natural that you discover their weaknesses and strengths, everyone does. Sociopaths and psychopaths may use this to their advantage, but does that make them a predator?
These "empaths" as they are called on your website are nothing but pieces of shit. I constantly read about them trying to "observe and understand" or "beat sociopaths at their own game". When I read about an "empath" creating some story of "beating a sociopath at his own game" I just want to punch my computer screen. Nearly every comment area on your website has some bullshit "empath" recalling some bullshit story about how they are super duper fucking awesome for being stupid fucking hypocrites. The fact that they call themselves empaths and then go and "play the sociopath game" is more twisted then anything a sociopath can ever do.
"I started giving the sociopath that works with me exactly the same treatment he gave me and other unsuspecting women, including exposing him to colleagues. He is running around complaining that he is so hurt and disappointed yet he had no problem doing this to me! what is with that? it seems to me that they are good at dishing it out but they can handle it themselves?"
See?
You've gone and attracted every fucked up person with self-esteem issues, thrown them into a tank full of wanna-be sociopaths, and have passed popcorn out to those smart enough to just sit in the stands and watch. Thanks for the popcorn, but the show is starting to piss me off.
it's a wolfy world
ReplyDeleteTo the Poster: Suck it up S!! There are consquences for abuse and harm you cause others. You just sound pathetic and needy yourself...The great thing about exposing an S is that other colleagues, peers, etc start observing his behavior and the S, is reduced to nothing but a pathetic joke. Way to go to the Empaths out there that are kicking the Sociopaths butts!!!
ReplyDeletePeople love an allegory. And western culture seems to highly value the position of being a victim, so the allegory of choice when classifying social roles often uses a predator and prey. (And being a predator is a bad thing nowadays) Realistically, all personality types or identifiers will fulfill these roles- and the nuanced ones unmentioned in between- at some point. But in reality, we are not one dimensional, some facets of ourselves surface more than others, but there's an endless potential in who one can be moment to moment. We can classify our existence however we want, but in truth existence isn't something that can be held on to and defined. We exist within an ever flowing present, complex and changing, more like grace notes or harmonic notes - you feel something just as long as it takes to feel it before it's gone and experience one moment of existence at a time, all the time.
ReplyDeleteUntil you don't.
But anyway, people love an allegory. And neat simple boxes, stacked in rows. If that's how they like to pass their moments, so be it.
i find not trying to be anything sort of fun, everything seems to open up then ... if you are "busy" trying to be something in a moment, how can you really see what is going on
ReplyDeleteThe analogy is wrong; wolves are pack animals.
ReplyDeleteA cat would be more accurate.
lol, there is actually a book out called "all cats have asperger syndrome" ... cats are super friendly once you get connect with them... they are very sensitive
ReplyDeleteSeems like the reader doesn't realize they have a choice to stop reading if they so choose to. Instead, their ego-driven desire to instantiate their superiority over everyone who comments/contributes out-weighs the logical decision to simply leave.
ReplyDeleteAll I hear is "whaaa whaa whaa."
If you can't appreciate the humour of the situation, then take your ball and play elsewhere.
To the reader who sent this b.s. to ME....
ReplyDeletePunching the computer screen, angry at people for sharing their thoughts...
I think you have bigger issues you should investigate.
Lol@ the person who posted...
ReplyDeletethe whole nature of sociopathy is quite predatory. And how insulting to empaths that you should get your nose out of joint when they feel like dishing the sh*t back to an S that has hurt them...thats kind of like saying being an empath, its your place to take the abuse of an S. Wake up, and grow up! If you're so sick of this site go find another one to rant your self righteous crap on, I find this site rather intersting and helpful :)
By the way, I think all of you are mistaken in thinking this individual is a sociopath (one by my standards, anyway). Narcissist would be more fitting. ;)
ReplyDeleteIshtar
ReplyDeleteBy the way, I think all of you are mistaken in thinking this individual is a sociopath (one by my standards, anyway). Narcissist would be more fitting. ;)
Naw I just think this person is a run of the mill asshole.
"We exist within an ever flowing present, complex and changing, more like grace notes or harmonic notes - you feel something just as long as it takes to feel it before it's gone and experience one moment of existence at a time, all the time.
ReplyDeleteUntil you don't."
This, is one of the most brilliantly written passages I've ever read.
Life is in the harmonics. Indeed.
I do see what the letter writer is saying. Sociopaths are still human, with full lives like the rest of us, and not just limited to being "predators". I highly doubt that most of them wake up saying to themselves, "Oh, how can I take advantage of ________ today?"
I highly doubt sociopaths are that focused. Or, at least, any more focused than "normals".
Just trying to make the most of it like everyone else.
Medusa-
ReplyDeleteWhere did you find that passage? It is well written indeed, struck a chord with me...very poetic.
Sarah said it up above in the comments.
ReplyDeleteI keep reading this notion over and over again either from sociopaths themselves or the people who defend the sociopath's hurtful behavior: that's it's unforgivable for an empath to dish out the same stuff that was given to them by the socio.
ReplyDeleteThe argument goes as follows: Since it is hardwired into the sociopath to use people/things/situations to their advantage (regardless of whether or not it hurts anyone), then they are less aware of their actions and therefore are less accountable. However, if an empath does so, then it is apparently more reprehensible because supposedly the empath plots and plans this action whereas the socio does his misdeeds impulsively.
I just don't get it.
But I agree with Sarah above. People love to categorize. Even the poster who abhors classifying a whole group of sociopaths with certain traits, classifies the entire group of empaths on M.E.'s site as "pieces of shit."
Now, I've never heard that term used medically to diagnose or categorize any personality disorder...however I certainly don't consider myself a piece of shit.
I wonder what box that category goes into?
if "dicktard" wants to punch his computer screen everytime an empath says their going to beat you at your game, then we've already won...sorry about your luck!
ReplyDeleteNaw I just think this person is a run of the mill asshole.
ReplyDeleteSame thing.
im disappointed that this garbage was given any weight... why post this retard's comments...the poster doesn't show any insight and sounds like a angst-ridden teenager..it is this type of portrayal of sociopaths that don't help advance any sort of real understanding.. its just a dumb rant...i bet he's a "vampire"
ReplyDeleteThe 'wolf' metaphor is just dumb - wolves are highly social pack animals. People with ASPD are not well integrated into their social group.
ReplyDeleteSome of the shrill condemnations of "sociopaths" lack perspective. Very few people with tendencies are Ted Bundyesque violent predators. The average S probably more resembles Creed from 'The Office' (my favorite TV sociopath).
Predators don't wake up wondering what they can kill, dumbass. They wake up wondering how they're going to get what they need or want, which often requires the sacrifice of another living creature. The 'predator' label fits. Quit being such a bitch.
ReplyDeleteLol at your weakness disguised as bravado. You sound like Jimmie Stewart when he gets really angry.
ReplyDeleteYou're easily made as a stupid person who 'cares' too much.
Someone hurt you once? Now you're mad! You're not gonna take it anymore!
Come on little faggot, tell us how you really feel . . .
Perhaps you will 'kick some dumbass's butt!' :)
"Vampire" my suspicion as well.
ReplyDeletePlease frequenters of this blog, out of curiosity:
1. Gender
2. Age
3. "vampire status," or other "rebel subculture" (ex. goth)
I'll start:
F
29
None
Medusa:
ReplyDelete"I highly doubt sociopaths are that focused. Or, at least, any more focused than 'normals'."
If you have to get up in the morning and ask yourself 'who should I fuck over today?' You're not a sociopath. Although chances are everyone DOES ask themselves that at some point, an empath is more likely to have to look for trouble or malice. I think the problem people have with sociopaths is that when they operate with malice or selfishness it's more of an 'instinctual' mechanism than 'cognoscente'.
BizLady:
"Since it is hardwired into the sociopath to use people/things/situations to their advantage..."
Aren't all humans, not currently in a coma, hardwired to use things to their advantage? Survival is imprinted upon us all. (Unless you want to take on Darwin.) To me, the conflict is that empaths identify with a larger collective and see their own existence dependent upon the survival of that collective. Sociopaths can have a small circle- more like a tribe- they protect, but often see survival as an independent responsibility.
ReplyDeleteIf you have to get up in the morning and ask yourself 'who should I fuck over today?' You're not a sociopath. Although chances are everyone DOES ask themselves that at some point, an empath is more likely to have to look for trouble or malice. I think the problem people have with sociopaths is that when they operate with malice or selfishness it's more of an 'instinctual' mechanism than 'cognoscente'.
I've noticed something along those lines after I've actually sat down and thought about my actions. The actions themselves are usually never blatantly obvious to others; deceit and diversion tend to come naturally as simply part of what needs to be done in a given situation. In other words, I don't realize that I've been lying to the extent that I have until after the fact.
Sarah,
ReplyDeleteNo, I don't believe all humans use other people at the expense of hurting others. Socio's cannot empathize and so another's discomfort is not even factored into the equation.
And yet, often, you will avoid doing something (even if you have something to gain from it) because you know it would hurt someone else.
But after reading everything else you wrote about the collective unconscious etc. I think we're essentially saying the same thing. You just seem to be using a more Jungian language.
It makes sense that empaths would identify more wholey on a collective because human beings are essentially hard-wired to be socially interdependent. The glitch in the sociopath is, as you say, he identifies ulitimately with himself and sees himself as an island. He may be loyal, until he's not.
And it can happen that quickly.
I'm the author of the "Hungry Like a Wolf?" post.
ReplyDeleteHow's everyone doing?
Alright, you guys got me interested again, and M.E. has made some delicious popcorn this time.
I could not stop laughing at most of these posts. I feel graced that such a poet decided to shower us with his/her beautiful analogies.
It's funny that while M.E. and I were emailing, at the beginning or end of every letter was "lol" or "ha." For instance, M.E.'s first response was, "ha, i love this!"
I just want to thank you all for making me laugh this morning as I wake up.
Oh, to the "wolves are social pack animals," douchers, I hate you. Wolves are awesome. Ever heard of "lone wolf"? Damn...
(The last paragraph was NOT written to illicit any type of emotional response from anyone)
lol
(Scratch that; this whole post was NOT written to illicit any type of response from anyone)
Brb I need more popcorn.
Oh, forgot to say this, the wolf in the picture of this post is pretty cool.
ReplyDeleteBelieve me, I'm hating myself for posting three times in a row, but I just remembered someone saying something about "vampires" or "goths".
ReplyDeleteTo the person who said this and to the people who agreed, you are idiots.
That is all.
cats > wolves
ReplyDeleteThat is all.
This is somewhat related to the original post, often I see the food chain spoken of here, being strewn about without any consideration as to why it is. It is slightly bothersome.
ReplyDeleteThe idea that there is a top of the food chain is nonsense. The reason being is that there is no top to a chain; chains are a series of interconnected links, there is no top. Really the word chain is simply a word for a specific relationship among links that causes a structure. This is illuminating because it shows that if there is a food chain there is no top, thus the “top predator” are just a symbiotic, interconnected part of a vast web of systems that depend upon each other.
Why would you try to falsify the meaning of a word and yet still base your argument on it? Why not use a whole new analogy altogether?
ReplyDeleteI was in a relationship with a man who assesed my weaknesses, then played them on me by telling me everything i needed to hear to fall under his spell and then when he was done with me he just wallked away and blamed me for the relationship ending. I'm being very conservative with details. A friend of mine who knows him well told me he's a sociopath. I thought he just had some anger issues. What a horrible experience it was! And the relationship lasted for only a few weeks. How could I have let this jerk do this to me? I guess I have my own stuff to work on. But I feel so used. He was so good at it. I feel like I won the lottery then found out the ticket was a fake.
ReplyDeletelol
ReplyDeleteanonymous:
ReplyDeleteOh, to the "wolves are social pack animals," douchers, I hate you. Wolves are awesome. Ever heard of "lone wolf"? Damn...
(The last paragraph was NOT written to illicit any type of emotional response from anyone)
Uh who is emotional? douchers, I hate you? gad what an idiot.
Narcissistic injury = rage.
ReplyDeleteI left a comment yesterday and Im not sure I posted in the right place. But I would like some guidence as to how to handle this man because he owes me a grand. I don't want him to think he can play me again. I do feel there are certain parts of him that are normal but they are over shadowed by his disorder. He just started a new job and that's when it took a dive. He is a truck driver and will be driving all week back on the weekends. He used my c card to buy new tires and I trusted him to pay me back. A friend of my sent him a text telling him to do just that and forget about me. I am so obsessed with trying to get back at him. But I know that many not be possible. He made me feel so good and in some sick way I want that again. So in my last email to him I said lets just have sex without all the lies and flattery he used to ge me in bed. I thought I would use him and leave in the middle of the night without him knowing. But he probably would't care if I did that. I really need help!!
ReplyDeleteThe other strange thing is he tells me he doesn't have true feelings for me. I only knew him for a month and he went from wanting to marry me and in three days he gradully dumped me. All that work he did to get me in bed. It was wonderful! He sent me videos of him telling me he loved me and bla bla. He also talks of his ex and he had these feelings with her that he never had before. He said he could just sink into her skin...he wants that feeling again he told me. But, this woman has problems in her life and didn't want to see him all the time..she pulled and then pushed him away. I just want to get him out of my head!! So I guess I have to go through this process of getting over him. Someone told me pretend he died and move on. Any feedback would be helpful. I find the blogs interesting and helfpful. I teach math and science in a private all boys high school. And with all my edjucation I don't understand this man!!
lions, cats known as "king of the jungle", are relatively social and hang out in prides and hunt and attack in coordinated organized fashion
ReplyDeleteTo Anonymous;
ReplyDeleteMove on - force yourself to walk away. No good will come from it. It's not his fault, the way we are is the way we are .. there's no point in trying to change things that can be changed - a protracted relationship that isn't meant to be .. if you're stubborn and dig your heals in, you'll end up far more hurt. Honestly - there is no other solution.
He does not - and cannot - love you.
You'll either destroy all the good things you have in your life, and be forced to start again .. or you can choose to walk away and start something new.
I chose option one .. I wouldn't recommend it.
You vs. Sociopath?
ReplyDeleteI'll take the sociopath. He's more fun.
sociopaths: the fact that u type "empaths" with a hint of disgust is welllll ...sad. none of you have anything to offer society, you are a waste of space..EMPATHY is what made the HUMAN RACE get to where it is today!! your disorder makes you so shallow even if your highly intelligent, youll have nothing good to offer the world because you cant imagine doing something unless iit has something "in it for me". keep living your pitiful lives and good luck with that.
ReplyDelete@Askew
ReplyDelete"the fact that u type "empaths" with a hint of disgust is welllll ...sad."
And the very same to you. For some reason all empaths seem to feel they are above us, and that they are somehow of more worth than us because we lack certain things you possess,
such as empathy. These things are not weaknesses, they are strengths, and for some reason empaths don't seem to realize their 'conscience' is just a burden they'd be better of without.
There are many of us that have done good in this world (not that it matters, as we have you to do it for us) yet you do not seem to recognize this. Stop and think for a moment, how many supposedly great people are likely to be sociopaths?
There are loads of them, in fact some could go as far to say the majority probably were sociopaths, or they at least had ASPD. This pretty much renders your argument useless, just like your empathetic selves. It's almost as if you label us as 'monsters' just to hide your own imperfections; you truly are rotten, gullible and odious creatures.
So, you know what? Keep living your pitiful life and good luck with that, you empaths truly are repulsive beings. No wonder the thought of so called 'empaths' disgust me.
I began a personal journey into lycanthropy a very long time ago ...with some rather interesting results...but that said.. I have perused the comments and would like to add a couple of things....
ReplyDeleteyes.. wolves are mostly pack animals..but a rogue male..or a lower status wolf can easily end up on their own..hence the "lone wolf" term.
Wolves have a strict psychology of dominance and hierachy within their packs, and have no compunction about killing the weak or banishing them from the pack.
These "lone" wolves roam the same woods...stalk the same prey, and live parallel lives to their pack counterparts, just with a solo mentality.
People equate sociopathy with lupine behaviours mostly because the medias images of wolves are portrayed as bloodthirsty, man-killing animals who will leap from behind every bloody dark tree to commit their heinous killing sprees....what shyte!...yes..a wolf is able to easily kill a human..and often have done so..WITHIN CAPTIVITY,and why wouldnt they. locked up and forced to endure human traits, food and care...god..that would send the strongest wolf insane!.
A lot of people identify their spirituality with wolves for the self importance off allying with a strong creature. Personally I think the lycanthrope bastardizations of human genes mixing with a wolfs is quite apt. Wrecking a strong creatures natural genetic defenses and warping it to suit our own needs is quite appealing, perhaps misguided, but parts of the whole were-wolf myth are based on facts.
It is these facts false or not that we gather to our bosom , change, manipulate and thus create within our psyches, a thought that when projected strongly enough, has the ability to change both form and thought. And that ...is a true creation. Form created from thought. Shape moulded from the 70% of our brains that we dont apparently use. Marvellous, and what a ready and willing tool for a sociopath to hone and use. The possibilities are endless.
Just because we are what we are does not mean that we cannot be fascinated. It just depends on the subject matter.
Sounds like the writer is as guilty of taking things personally when the tables are turned and turned into a whiney bitch. What a fucking drama queen.
ReplyDeleteAlso, when I think of wolves I think of the essential quality of wolves, it is their social nature that comes to mind.
Honestly, a parasite is more accurate than a predator.
Somebody has already pointed out that wolves are pack animals, however sociopaths are too. I think the distinguish feature of sociopaths is they don't care for anyone, whilst wolves care for their cubs. That said, I liken sociopaths more to cuckoos, which leave their egg in somebody else's nest and forget about them.
ReplyDelete@psycothetic
ReplyDeleteI would have to say i understand your point of view. Empaths seem to have the desire to beat "the sociopath" at his own game, with hope that in doing so they will feel superior and above them. They seem to have the need to prove that they are equal to and greater than sociopaths.
Now, delving further into my point, and looking at this from a strictly logical stand point. With the 'game' that sociopaths play, how can an empath possibly win. Considering the fact, that a sociopath does not, cannot care, does not, cannot love. The fact that empaths are totally opposite of that, and do very much care, and very much so would end up inlove with the sociopath(considering he will become her dream, her fantasy). Then it is safe to come to a conclusion that the only person that can end up hurt would be the empath, so, regardless of how they think they win, or how they brag, to try and feel superior, empaths are the one that will inevitably end up hurt. Where else the sociopath would simply incur some discomfort and would move on without a thought, or care.
To place this in a simple analogy. Imagine the scenario between a man and a woman, the man does not care about the woman. The woman being inlove with the man. No matter what she tries he will not care. The more she fights the more emotionally involve she become, the stronger her obsession. Not realizing her addiction, her obsession, she continues, deluding herself into thinking she is getting somewhere. That she will get back at him. Whereby the sociopath who is using her for some purpose, who will stop and walk away the second she has served her purpose. The woman cannot possible win, all she will receive is pain.
I find from what i read on this site, that people who claim to have beaten the sociopath at their own game. Well quite frankly sad. How can you play and win, you dont even know the rules of the game. It is because of this empathic mentality that allows sociopaths to rise above and actually make something out of their lives, and become somebody.
able to put up with their antics, you have to be able to sustain the abuse long enough to overcome. First early detection is key – once you detect them – you can then work to their desire to target you. Never talk of your successes, or failures. Rather make up some things that semi – hurt you – long ago - that your not that upset over –give them a fake target. If it’s a sociopath you want to get rid of its not that hard -
ReplyDeletebe boring, depressed, and physically become “ill” say you lost all ur money, ur job. Don’t be emotional , don’t argue –NEVER appear to flee/run – they are like a rabid animal – play"RAG DOLL". After 6 months they find a new victim u have a new life.
The worst sociopath is the covetous, don't expect a fast resolution w them. You have to be an actress, acting like they are the best. They want to anger u – if you act like they are always right even when they discredit you - this takes away their favorite game, they want to make you attack so they can play victim. U cant beat them alone – U need a group don’t isolate.
But mostly to beat them you have to be a "resilient", this is a type of people who is successful despite all the worst odds, no parents, poor, abused, raped - but straight A student, high achievers. A Resilient will handle circumstances that most would find untenable such as dealing w a sociopath. They can be around crazy people -and not blame themselves, and still achieve - these are the types who bet a sociopath. Most people blames themselves and let it hurt them and their lives.