Continuing the theme of fun parallels, this New York Times article about Chaz Bono and the transgendered:
The two men compared today’s cultural blind spot regarding transgender people to attitudes about homosexuality during World War II, when homosexuals in the armed forces were considered psychiatrically abnormal and were court-martialed and dishonorably discharged. Until 1999, gender identity disorder was also classified as a mental disorder. Though it is now considered a medical issue, the “disorder” stigma is difficult for any marginalized group to shake.The oddest quote to me is when Cher says, " “If I woke up tomorrow in the body of a man, I couldn’t get to the surgeon fast enough.” If I woke up in a different body of any gender, I don't think I would mind at all. I think it would be fun and exciting, particularly at first. I mean, the limitations of gender and body can be annoying, but if you have to have them at all, it might be fun to mix it up.
“The notion of trans is incomprehensible to most people,” Mr. Bailey said. “It is so foreign.”
***
History mostly demonstrates the violence of embracing either pole of moral certainty. The black and white of gender identification has always pushed an infinitude of differences into the margins.
So sociopaths will one day be free from a disorder stigma...?
ReplyDeleteThat's another kind of beast, methinks. Sexual identity - it is said - should not be considered a disorder because it's an inner trait that carries no negative consequences for the individual's health in and of itself. Any unhealthy influence will be externally contextual, or generated by other traits not directly correlated.
It is a common argument that pedophiles should be looked upon from the same perspective. And there lies the flaw in the argument. We could talk about how this condition is nurtured by traumatizing experience (so it's pathological already in its design), but we should mainly attain to the fact that we're talking about the claim of the right to abuse someone. So... we're claiming we have the right to trump someone else's right? It doesn't add up. Rights should work in harmony, otherwise it's just someone with more of it than the other, wich renders the whole concept moot, wich in turn renders useless the claim in the first place.
That's why I think a condition like ASPD/PCLR has a hard time presenting its case in a lighter tone. We're talking about freeing from any (or many) managerial measures individuals who are - by definition - against the societal structure (Anti-Social). They're invoking the rights promoted by a social contract that they, by nature, are apathetic or even antagonistic to.
The problem with hoping that we'll eventually be accepted is that unlike any other group, we're perceived as THE evil. Not like 'a' disordered, unwanted, or dysfunctional minority, which is the case with all the other groups throughout time... that is, except for a few, which do no longer exist (for that very reason).
ReplyDeleteI think it will depend on who's in power. At present those in power are not unlike 'us', but that is also why they don't care that much.
If the empath majority was to gain real power, we might have a chance (for obvious reasons).
Most of all I think our present position as our time's Devil and cause of all evil is a sign of transition. Who knows what will replace modern day society?
I'm very sure it will be replaced, and out best chance is to not leave it up to the present norm and those who represent it, to decide our future.
Whereas I find it stimulating and interesting to propagate communication between our groups (Sociopaths/Psychopaths and the neurotypical majority), I don't hold much belief in it being really possible. We're too different from them, and they view our impact upon their lives as too malignant for them to ever be likely to change their view on us.
Now about the idea of waking up with a different gender. Lol... I've played with that idea. - When I was a child I played with the idea of waking up in an animal form.
I'm completely confident I'd do just as well with the other gender as I do with my present one. We're not as attached to gender specific self understanding as are most people, and that's why I think it won't be much of a problem ... of course, all depending upon personality apart from what's strictly gender related in the individual psychopath.
I'm saying psychopath here, because I'm not sure it would be as easy to a sociopath, as I understand the term (interested folks may visit my website for more on that, you shall be welcome).
It's a fun idea to play with. - And maybe some day it will be reality that one can change forth and back. It would take a complete rewriting of reality, but that's been done several times in the history of man. Just take the idea of a Flat Earth. This was reality to those who lived then, and it worked for them until paradigm was changed - and change is inevitable.
Change is Life. Life is hated because it harbors in it Death and Destruction. That was the thesis of Christ. Nietzsche, was right when he said (about Christ) 'God is dead!'!... '^L^,
AMoralBing,
ReplyDelete"Any unhealthy influence will be externally contextual, or generated by other traits not directly correlated."
Exactly. So the question will be: Who is to decide what is 'unhealthy'. And for whom? For those who prefer status quo, or for those who represent this influence and who are generators of change?
Change is always painful to the majority. Always! And for as long as majority (= the mediocre) decides what is good and bad, we will be stigmatized!
You have some good points:
"They're invoking the rights promoted by a social contract that they, by nature, are apathetic or even antagonistic to."
Yes, that is the way I see it (and it's how it is!). It's also in the very definition of AsPD.
Antisocial traits are also part of psychopathy. And they're to some extent part of sociopathy (antisocial behavior towards those who aren't included in the sociopath's sub-culture).
Again, I follow the school of Robert Hare, because in the present context it makes most sense.
Of course I have my own school of thought as well, and it doesn't fit any of the scholar experts. But I am not alone - which anyone who bothers to dig deep enough will understand!... '^L^,
Two decades ago I saw a man's vajayjay, close up, as he got undressed backstage. It looked like his cock had been brutally hacked off with a serrated knife.
ReplyDeletePerhaps it had - I dare say that gender reassignment surgery was once the exclusive domain of butchers and do-it-yourself body modification is as old as time itself.
I asked him what sex felt like for him as a woman, compared to as a man, and he told me. He also explained how his vajayjay was structured, and told me no, he didn't miss his cock.
Nowadays I often find transgender people seated opposite me on trains - middle-aged 'women' look especially convincing to my mind - and I can only imagine what hell it would be to feel that your mind didn't match your flesh.
Biological intervention has been socially sanctioned but I don't believe that trans prejudice will be eliminated in the West any time soon as our culturally defined notions of gender, and sex, are too rigid - and strong.
The West is also more obsessed than ever with correcting anything perceived to be 'nature's mistakes' for social control and profit - elsewhere in the world it is recognised that no two human beings are created equally.
But to my mind that's where the parallels between 'victimised' sociopaths and 'victimised' transgender people begins - and ends.
I'd love to be a tourist in anyone's mind for a day - male hormones too would just be the icing on the proverbial cake.
ReplyDeleteYou know, the term "anti-social" is an odd one. Most things people call anti-social I'd say were asocial. They aren't actively against social order, the norms of society, whatever, so much as they're just completely indifferent to them.
ReplyDeleteIt's an odd "with us or against us" dynamic...
HAPPY MOTHERS DAY, SW.
ReplyDeleteI have the suspicion Cher felt like saying that because she must be insecure about the fact that she looks like a man. A horse of a man. I think all her extreme sexual appearances tie into the fear of someone someday pointing out how much of a mannish looking woman she is. like how many gay guys were fighter jet pilots in the navy.
ReplyDeleteif i woke up in a man's body one day i would stay home for days and keep experimenting with my dick. i'd like to really get to know my dick. like what gives it arousal, in how many seconds/minutes, how long my arousal is sustained by a particular stimulus, etc. i would also like to measure its temperature as changes occur.
It has always been fascinating to me that men have this one organ with a mind of its own and cannot hide that from them. like we have no idea what our esophagus is doing but to actually get a pulse and a blood flow leading to a size change is fascinating to watch. like a geological discovery. like volcanos.
since i'm all for more freedom i do see the male gender to be more free and unlike cher i would not have minded waking up as a man one day and staying that way. but, don't remember ever thinking that i wish i was born as a man in terms of physical appearance. i love my curves and soft skin and could not give up on those even in my wildest dreams of playing with an extension between my legs.
(kesu, i responded to you in the previous day's post).
HA! You should all be thankful your mother endured 40 weeks and a harsh labor to present your special snowflake to the world. Its not an easy job, especially when you are the eternal projection screen of time.
ReplyDeleteAnd the soft, loving, nurturing of the mother archetype is as present as is her mother nature elemental savage. Never blame your mother, (boring, boring, boring) she is your genetic tap root, dear mammals.
In the worldwide phenomena of the Harry Potter's series "a mother's love" is what thwarted Voldermont's death curse and bonded the two character together and a seven book power struggle. Careful, we pack a whammy in the love, bond, drama and protection racket. And J.K. Rowlings is laughing all the way to the bank.
"The heart of a mother is a deep abyss at the bottom of which you will always find forgiveness" -Honore de Balzac (and he was such a delightful handful)
Just look at M.E.'s picture for today's post. Everyone wants to create, mold life and have the power of awareness to forgive.
Please stop diluting and bastardising Camille.
ReplyDeleteI invent nothing, I rediscover.
ReplyDeleteAuguste Rodin
from earth: translate that request anon
ReplyDeleteOh, but I don't speak the language of Earth, another anon :(
ReplyDeleteI've sent you smoke signals instead - do let me know if reception is spotty due to inclement weather and I'll try again.
wtf r u a schizophrnic
ReplyDeleteI'm dating a schizophrenic. It's so much fun to feed her delusions and watch her freak out. I can't force her to hallucinate, but I can convince her to. Who needs TV when you've got an unmedicated human being in full psychotic episode being drip-fed a steady diet of rabid paranoia?
ReplyDelete^Fucking hilarious.
ReplyDeleteboring
ReplyDeleteHAPPY MOTHERS DAY, YOU ALL MOTHER F's.
ReplyDeleteYou're all pathetic idiots compared to me.
ReplyDeleteret, when she comes home find an excuse, step out and move her car to another location without her realizing. later see if she'll be able to question the fact that she did not park there.
ReplyDeletehow is the weather in new york?
ReplyDeleteput her purse in the fridge and then say you didn't do it lol
ReplyDelete"put her purse in the fridge and then say you didn't do it lol"
ReplyDeleteLOL!
Your mother just fucked you for mother's Day
ReplyDeleteCheers
That is so mean to tease the schizos!
ReplyDeleteAre you a psycho or what?
that car trick led a schizo to a successful suicide when done over three years repetitively
ReplyDeleteHappy Mother's Day!
ReplyDelete"put her purse in the fridge and then say you didn't do it lol"
ReplyDeleteAgain... why socios have a hard time presenting their case, lol
@Zhawq
"So the question will be: Who is to decide what is 'unhealthy'. And for whom?"
I hear ya, that seems what the whole issue boils down to... it's either revolution or status quo, because every revolution is ilegitimate.
Like anon 6:26 said, "It's an odd "with us or against us" dynamic..."
The funniest part is socios in general seem to like having a society the way it is (i.e. majority unaware, biased and missing the point about them), because then they have something to prey upon. Talk about irony...
I like society the way it is because I've been able to adapt to its many nuances... If it changed, I'd have to adapt again! On a smaller scale, this happens whenever you move, the sheer amount shifting depending on where you were before, where you've been in the past, and the now, all compared to each other and weighted.
ReplyDeleteAs it stands right now, I don't think psychopathy/sociopathy awareness is a good thing for the masses, the same way schizophrenia isn't. It will become stereotyped more than it already is, and the media like any hungry creature will feed upon new pray until the bones are gobbled up too.
Basically, the more ignorant they are, the better. If they don't know what a psychopath/sociopath is, and aren't terribly curious about it, they will be more willing to accept your definition, as opposed to the one they've been force-fed. Think Communism in the 20th century, for example.
Ideally we'd be accepted for who we are, but realistically, when will that ever happen? You can't be treated as an equal in the States if you have a vagina or are a shade or two too dark in skin color, what chance would you have with psychopath added as a weight around your neck? Not in this lifetime, certainly not in this country. And we're not even the worst when it comes to psychological prejudice. In the UK, you can have an indefinite prison sentence (life sentence) for being a P/S type that has committed a felony crime.
All in all, the prospects are more grim than bright. Like sociopaths, the more people know about sociopathy, the more scared they become. What once was a monster under the bed that you wished wasn't there becomes a reality, a corporate, political and criminal pandemic, sometimes all three at once.
Often times when I blog, I feel less like I'm educating people and more like letting them in on a dirty little secret, letting the mask drop and daring them to return the gaze. Or at best, showing their face as well.
Pandemic, monsters under the bed, dirty little secret? Such drama. Putting your fish hook out to play, Note?
ReplyDeletePeek-a-boo.
Do you actually disagree?
ReplyDeleteI don't imagine you're one to have an aversion to drama. What script are you inking as of now, Soulfulpath? A comedy? A romance?
Mine centers on a Byronic hero, and is of course somewhat autobiographical, what else? I guess all of my creations have at least a little bit of me inside of them.
I do not disagree. I condone. You are always looking outside yourself for definition. The Byronic hero motif must hook many in your trippy-traps. Especially the romantically inflamed.
ReplyDeleteAm I? An interesting observation.
ReplyDeleteRomantically, yes, it works too well. Some charades are just too taxing to keep going, though.
Seduction is... a double edged blade. Sometimes it cuts when or where you don't want it to. I find this is especially true with platonic relations. You show someone everything they want to see in a person, and what do they do? They look for more. Typical. Whether it be pleasure, business, or some other facet, they always look for more. After all, you're the most interesting, understanding, and fun person in their circle (usually). They prop you up on a pedestal whether you want them to or not, and voila, a new hero! Albeit a flawed one...
Oh.
:)
Everyone is intrigued by mystery, unpredictability and pleasure. Yes, wanting more can be tricky. Is it greed, addiction to unveiling the onion or the pleasure of acting on our wits. At some level, does it matter?
ReplyDeleteBeing on a pedestal is a job someone has to fill. We all look for heros/heroines to project on like some quasi leadership worship. Consider it a public service.
Oh, the George Carlin monologue on mothers was poignant. Proves we are the stronger of the sexes which imperative or should I say a successful tactic.
Voila squared!
Being on a pedestal is a job someone has to fill...Consider it a public service.
ReplyDeleteAh, the sociopathic ego - or should that be - aarrgghhh, the sociopathic ego. Hehe :p
Definitely a public service. Am I being the pro-bono psychologist today? Marriage councilor? Professor? Muscle? Mechanic? Prostitute? Father?
ReplyDeleteIt's not unfounded ego at all, at least. The funny thing about acting so many roles is that eventually they become part of you, genuine or not. Not one ever quite being a whole, but just enough for people to notice, to cling to, to hunger for.
As for the stronger sex... No, not biologically speaking at least. The more resilient? Definitely.
The aarrrgghhh or grrrrrrrr can perhaps become a prrrrrrrr when receiving praise and privilege. ;p
ReplyDeleteSociopathy is all about self-interest my ass! There is a stronger desire for making an impact which includes the other. Almost a secret need. It's the powerlessness piece. Opps, I am speaking of a taboo subject.
ReplyDeleteResilient is a form of strength. Deep strength.
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ReplyDeleteYes, and there are several forms of strength, not all in which man or woman is superior across the board. Biological Checks and Balances, perhaps?
ReplyDeleteSociopathy is NOT all about self interest, but self interest is the primary priority. After all, how can you help someone/thing out if you aren't taking care of yourself, with any measure of success? Without a full emotional tool box, we're more primal creatures, and survival and self interest is always going to be important.
Selflessness is only beneficial on the grand scale after selfishness. Burn a candle at both ends at the same time and it will melt twice as fast. That candle is your well being.
Selflessness is not the taboo word, dear. That's for martyrs and uber empaths.
ReplyDeleteWhat is the opposing duality to the drive to power?
Powerlessness. Drives one to anger, you know. And shhhhh power and powerlessness are secret lovers.
What's with this idiotic article in Salon today on psychopathy?
ReplyDeleteMoron thinks psychopathy and sociopathy are the same as 'insanity', 'madness' and 'lunacy'.
Since when has Salon been interested in truth over glibness and superficiality, Ms. Christ?
ReplyDeleteWriters are all the "the Goldilocks of craziness." No worries the author, Laura Miller mentally lives in Narnia.
ReplyDeleteRight on cue Medusa. Your post popped up just as Gorécki - Symphonie No.3 - 2nd Movement emerged in the background.
Well yay, another Gorecki fan in the house.
ReplyDeleteWhere the hell is PMS these days?
Menopause
ReplyDeleteHah.
ReplyDeleteMEN....oh.......pause.
Regarding the topic, male/female, makes no difference to me, as I don't see myself as one or the other, never have.
I don't quite get the trans thing, actually. Since it's not the hormones that make them feel like a man or a woman, it's their mind.
And how did the distinctions get in their minds in the first place? Are we born with gender ideas? Are women born wanting to wear dresses and makeup? Eh. Constructs.
Never bought the whole "born this way" mentality, and I only buy the "it's not a choice" mentality to a certain extent.
Way too black and white, way too simplified.
The pedastal will crumble from all take and no give.
ReplyDeleteYou keep getting gas from the smae pump without any deliveries and it hits empty.
Actually, Medusa, hormones in the womb can affect a person's sexuality and to some extent, their gender identity. It's been a while since I read up on it, but another odd thing is that the more boys a mother gives birth to, the more likely they'll be homosexual. Some sort of biological defense mechanism, apparently.
ReplyDeleteIn many cases, conflicting gender identity and homosexuality are not life-style choices at all.
It's not sexuality or sexual orientation that I am concerned with, it is gender. Two different things.
ReplyDeleteI commented on gender...
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteFollow smoke? Imagine chasing something that ephemeral-- simply because Rorschach forced a sign. (I swear It wasn 't me baby). We're all prey to illusion in mirrored halls. Am more of an archivist and Don't keep office hours here. I like to take it in swaths, Patterns broad and deep (all for my own amusement).
ReplyDeleteWill be sure to curtesy if I see you In passing, Natch.