To me these things aren't contradictions. I never felt like the victim of abuse. Although I have sometimes played the role of victim (provoking my father, trying to get teachers fired or get better educational/job opportunities, etc.), perhaps due to my self-delusion/megalomania about being powerful and being someone who acts rather than be acted upon, or perhaps due to an inability to really feel bad about bad consequences that happen to me, I have never been able to actually identify with victimhood. I love my breasts, but I know that objectively I am average looking (I feel like men should understand this concept well, I feel like I have almost never known a man who wasn't infatuated with his genitalia). And I just happen to be smarter than most people -- that is exactly what it means to score in the 99th percentile on tests measuring intelligence (at least speaking of the type(s) of intelligence that these tests are meant to measure, and I acknowledge even in the book that there are a variety of different ways to be intelligent). Being smarter than most people is a fact about me the same way that my height and weight are facts. If I were exceptionally tall or fat, I would acknowledge those things about myself too without making any normative judgment that being tall makes me better or being fat makes me worse. I know people tend to think that smarter = better, but I have seen enough incompetent geniuses to not hold this opinion myself.
But I think people's negative reactions to seeming contradictions suggests something about people's discomfort with ambiguity. From Joss Whedon's recent graduation address to Wesleyan University:
[Our culture] is not long on contradiction or ambiguity. … It likes things to be simple, it likes things to be pigeonholed—good or bad, black or white, blue or red. And we’re not that. We’re more interesting than that. And the way that we go into the world understanding is to have these contradictions in ourselves and see them in other people and not judge them for it. To know that, in a world where debate has kind of fallen away and given way to shouting and bullying, that the best thing is not just the idea of honest debate, the best thing is losing the debate, because it means that you learn something and you changed your position. The only way really to understand your position and its worth is to understand the opposite.
That doesn’t mean the crazy guy on the radio who is spewing hate, it means the decent human truths of all the people who feel the need to listen to that guy. You are connected to those people. They’re connected to him. You can’t get away from it. This connection is part of contradiction. It is the tension I was talking about. This tension isn’t about two opposite points, it’s about the line in between them, and it’s being stretched by them. We need to acknowledge and honor that tension, and the connection that that tension is a part of. Our connection not just to the people we love, but to everybody, including people we can’t stand and wish weren’t around. The connection we have is part of what defines us on such a basic level.
I liked this a lot. Some of the most black and white thinkers use sources that are anything but, e.g. the ultra-religious using scriptural texts that portray a God of seeming contradictions (both kind and vengeful, both forgiving and damning) to justify making their own black and white assessments of certain things as being pure evil and others being unassailable good. A little like the junk science you see in sociopath research. The Joss Whedon quote also reminded me of one of my favorite twitter quotes:
"What is this "good" versus "evil" bullshit? There are no such animals in the real world. We do not live in a comic book for Christ's sake."
— M.E. (@sociopathworld) July 28, 2013
UPDATE: I think this article about being gay and Catholic is very interesting and relevant to any discussion of seeming contradictions and how there are many ways to live a life consistent with what you believe, despite what everyone else might think.
i'm badman
ReplyDeleteaka slechteman
DeleteSlight shift from slechte man to schlechter Mann. ;)
DeleteWhat about Eve and the femme fatale proto-/archetype in its diverse variations over the cultures and centuries?
I vividly remember an encounter on the pages of Faucault's Madness and Society with a woman lost in historical medical archives. As I remember it, she was sent for evaluation by her family since she refused to get married. The guy that had to evaluate her seems to have been pretty puzzled. Her argument felt completely rational, not mad.
Back to the song. Who is the sociopath in the little break up story in the song text I linked to above? The guy that does not cry (shed tears) or the woman that wants to lead him somewhere where he is not willing to go?
The American Psycho, or Patrick Bateman is a real challenge for someone usually not too interested in fashion and brands or outer shells. Bateman, Badman? But interesting. I need to reload my Kindle. ;)
slachterman
DeleteAll authentic spiritual teachings are paradoxical in nature. It's the
ReplyDeleteYin and Yang of things. "Whoever would save his life must lose it..."
Baptism, for example, being buried under the water to "raise up" to a
life.
The "old" ego (Which is ALWAYS accquired.) must be cast off, like a snake
shedding it's skin so that new life can spring forth, like a seed that
"dies" to itself and becomes a plant.
This is why Easter is in springtime and why the Savior of the world met
his death on a green living tree, NOT on two "dead" pieces of wood.
The Almond tree was the "Tree of Life" in the Garden Of Eden. It was on
this tree that Christ was crucifyed. Paradox again.
Man needs to understand contradiction and to make his peace with this fact. He needs "self" (egoistic) sacrafice so he can become "born again"
and enter into the "Kingdom."
When people say to thine own self be true, doesn, t it seem like one isnt being true to onesself if one keeps changing positions ?
ReplyDeleteMacempath talked about moral something the other day. It wasnt compass, it was something related to what you yourself is steadfast about to yourself. It is about being true to yourself and not wavering on personal integrity to onessrlf.
Here we talk about victim mentality and also seeing ourselves not as victims . Well when i see other people do one thing and say another i feel like they have a drive which overrides the decisions we make. The drives we have do not make "sense". They make us human. They cause us to give leeway regarding moral "fill in word"
Jon said the other day that a narcissist is wslking contradiction and so is a psychopath. So they are not practicing to thine own self be true
? This is because of the divided srlf....the real self and false self?
I will be specific and talk about my life as an example.
I dont like to be cheated on. It is a crime on my self if I see it hsppening and do not stop seeing the cheater. I am practicing good morsl ehatever . Then the next day I ssy to mysrlf hey you know ehat? I getting really so much from my charade of a relationship pretending I dont know about said cheating, why should ibfuck it up hy letting on I know aboutit? I will be forced to breaknup with them then and I dont wsnt to do that. If I dont do the breakup I am not being true to half myselg, right? So am I mak7ng mysrlf a gictime to half mysrlf, lying to mysrlf that it is ok because look at all these nice things inget staying together.... ?
Do you see hoe on the outside I wouod look like a woman letting a man get away with shit because of drives which cause me to ferl I am weak?
There is both wesk and strong at the same time going in opposite directions. The self is divided. People will look snd I will also look and judge mystlf as a fucking stupid idiot if I stay snd yet the oyhet half says fuck you to the other people and to the voice I berate myself with.
Which ownbself should I be truecand where is my moral whatever, ok?
And we have peope here over and over saying their drives keep them addicted to their csociopath . So now these victimsvare also divided . They dont care orvdontvchose tk care.
I spent a half a day trying to decide whst kind if arrangment I wss willing to settlevfor re my narc socio treasure., itvwas a half a fucking day of bsck and firth in my mind. I could not mske a decision from any other point of view than to intellectualize with logic. At the end if thecday that is what I did. I reallt had no choice but to dump him ,
Now it was the right choice. But I still do think it was a decision made after emotional hyrt and snger anger anger. But still did not decide based on emotions,
I dont understsnd sny of these round and round discussions about victimhood or being true to oneeself and moral whatever.
No I willl not edit this pewage tldr.
Sorry but on a device driving me craxy and too busy.
How do you know if you are happy is my question.
DeleteI ultimately dont care ehat another thinkd. I just dont want to hsve to fucking explain why and how I would have gone to the practical decision of staying with a cheater after having complained .
DeleteI had these fucking people advising me about what it is I feel. What about what think. Isnt that jusg as valid.
"I just dont want to hsve to fucking explain why and how I would have gone to the practical decision of staying with a cheater after having complained ."
DeleteSo you disapprove cheating. And in order to not be hypocritical, you would have had to break up with the cheater. But you liked the benefits from the relationship, and whatever output you generated from the relationship weighed heavier for you than the fact that someone was overstepping your principle. But you didn't want to be seen as a victim (or as a hypocrite), and thus broke off the relationship; for the sake of not having to defend your choices.
The only frustration I can see is claiming that you disapprove of cheaters in the first instance. If you drop the principle in the future, someone can cheat on you; you can ignore the cheating and keep benefiting from the relationship for the undefined period of time, and you won't have to justify your actions. And to avoid the "victim" label, just claim that you are in an open relationship (since you are if it doesn't bother you).
"to thine own self be true" - divided self of having a true self and a false self
The magnitude of the false self is probably determined by how far own's true self deviates from society's conformities, and one's need to conform to society.
For example, if you believe your true self is defined by pedophilia, and you don't worry about conforming to society (or living out life in prison for that matter), then your false self would probably be insignificant.
It all depends on how you define yourself.
Hi. Thank you for your response.
ReplyDeleteI do not know how I feel a lot so this is pretty hard for me. I will take one of your interpretations of my confusing account one at a time.
It is notvabout whether or not I "approve" of cheating. It is more complicated.
I do not like the way it makes me feel ifsomeone is going to lie to my face about it. Id like the opportunity to know from them that they are looking outsider the relationship for other satisfac5ion. I dont think the doube standard is sthg I can stomach. I might resort to playing games and want to punish hard. I would play with them as a cat and mouse...i w6oukd torture. Not worth my energy. Been there done that. Boring waste of energy.I dont approve of that thing for me right there, I have better things to do than waste my time on a liar. I hate douchebag liars. But I wholeheartedly 6bderstand them wanting to get away with shit bec most people restrict their fantasies and then resent you fir being a ball and chain. Inunderstand the impulse and have hard time being judgmental about it.
I think it is cowardly to lie. But lots of people want their cake and eat it too. ?.tbh I would probably not go along with such an arrangment...them going out and sleeping wth other women. However I understand the desires and drive to do so and I would not say "I disapprove" flat out.
Suffice it to say that I would be like jon and lose interest if I was not providibg them with enough stimulation. It is insulting even though I am confident and mostbof the time talk to myself so i do not take things personally. I believe in that. -see, i have bpd traits in that I will never feel "enough" as it is. I do not feel like fostering these notions.as that feel masochistic to me and I want to atleast stay a nonvictim to my
own self. Do you understand what I mean? I do not feel like victim from thebother personl I feel like I am a victim to myself if I continue to allow reinforcement of negative feelings over and over.
I envy people who can have open relationships. I do not think I could do it. Once, to the douchbag narcussist treasure, I asked for one giving him paranoia. It was good. But I lied. I do wish I could take my ego out of this monogamous stuff. I am who I am though and I suppose I have to describe myself ...define myself rather.. as a serial monogamist. Okay that is a definition. I do not like that because I am in contradiction but I guess I dont hsve chouce. Do I?
DeleteI want to fit myself around situations a lot. Instead of having me defined I will bend in order to make my self fit. I do not like definitions of my self. It does not work that way all the time. I want options.
DeleteDefinitions leaving me strapped in and indont like that. Do I have to define myself? I say no I do not, but in certain situations I guess I do in order so I can act within my boundaries and beca decisive person not a wishy washy?
I do not like to lie but I will somtimes pretend I am lying in order to give someone paranoia if they are pulling a fast one cheating. Is that the narcissistic way or the borderline way? Or is it the normal healthy way to handle a narcissistic douchebag?
DeleteIow I will pretend that I am cheating to mirror the cheater. But to give paranoia also.
DeleteYou are without a doubt a victim in this case in some ways. For one, he has led you to believe that he would be faithful, and then did not confess when he broke his promise. Therefore, he lied to you, making you a victim of deception.
DeleteI personally hate using the term "cheating". I first understood the term as cheating in a game, when i was a child. I think typing in a cheat code in a video game or paying a referee to bend the rules so you can win football bets, and fucking people other than your mate are different things, entirely different, Cheating in a game involves doing something that gives you an unfair advantage over your opponent, whereas cheating in a relationship doesn't necessarily give you any strategic advantages toward much of anything besides having more people to fuck. So I just think cheating is a horrible word for the purpose of describing the phenomenon.
But anyway, I really think you should reconsider open relationships. Are you a sociopath yourself? I have always had issues with monogamy, as I've gotten older I would like to have someone to hold me every night since I always go to bed alone, I have never been in a committed sexual relationship with a man or woman. I have had sex with plenty of people but its mostly one night stands, week long flings or an occasional friends with benefts thing, but they have always been no strings attached.
I personally feel that since you don't want to end the relationship, it's best to stick around to enjoy the benefits. However, if he's not satisfying your demands then it's time to manipulate him in some way. Talking to him won't do shit most likely. Instead, have sex with one of his friends and take pictures. Then, tell him "I found out you fucked someone else, and I'm not too upset about that, I know you'll come back to me. However, this is not fair. If you can fuck other people, that means I can too. Take a look at these pics!" Then explain to him you are willing to still committ, but he has to be more faithful or you will fuck other people.
Granted, you say you are a serial monogamist. So obviously, you dont want to fuck other people anyway. But by at least pretending that you do want to fuck other people, you will have more leverage on him than if he thinks your all he's got. It's just like how your coke dealer is more likely to put alot of cut in your eightball if he knows he's your ONLY connect. If he knows you will start going elsewhere, they are less likely to make you want to go elsewhere. But if they know that there is no elsewhere, what incentive do they have? So regardless of whether you ever want to have sex with anyone other than him or not, let him know that you will be a total whore if he cant commit to you (even if you wont be). This will put him on edge and then he may change his behavior.
L O L on the stalking myself pics to manipulate. I love it lol
DeleteBut I have my own brand of soft power manipulations very covert, very good. I had written a long post, but it got eaten up. I will be a braggart if i share. I will share.
My thing is that i like a man to feel like a man, not to dominate .. oh yes, there is a time and place to dominate and show anger and make them scared.. But when it comes to some manipulations, i do not ever want to emasculate. That pic thing would emasculate. No i want my man to be manly and not lose confidence. I don't want his peepee to have an identity crisis.
I make him feel special, boost his ego, fuck him like he's never been fucked, charm his friends and family , and then subtlely put it out there that i have dated and enjoyed fat guys and sociopaths so they know they're replaceable with just about anyone. Works like a fucking charm. If they cheat, i do softly " oh well that is life, it is not sthg i am into, but if you'd like to fuck now and then i'm down with that. You aren't for long term commitment for me. and that is fine." They do double take and think i am the cat's meow and work hard to please and be a better man. It is all very soft and matter of fact, no emotions, just nice make-up good posture and grace. This is after i go scream my head off somewhere alone.
No i am not a sociopath. And no, this doesn't work with the sociopath. Not that i know of.
It is v nice to spend the night with one person regularly. i only want that 2 times maybe 3x per week so i can crave it. if you like alcohol it is lovely to not drink for a while, then indulge and enjoy the best buzz ever.
DeleteMaybe you can start off no strings attached and train yourself to get used to the strings. Manipulate your mind for 6 month, see how it goes.
"I do not like to lie but I will somtimes pretend I am lying in order to give someone paranoia if they are pulling a fast one cheating."
ReplyDeleteI would say that is simply manipulating someone into being honest with you (catching them in their own trap). Which is generally a human/(acceptable) reaction.
From what you said in the other postings, I would say that yes, you want to define yourself to an extent in order to have guidelines according to which you want to function. But you don't like setting strict principles, since you don't want to be judged according to these principles, and you also try to avoid judging others - since you hate double standards/ being a hypocrite in so doing.
If the previously-stated is the case, then the only problem I see is consistently trying to not end up in a situation in which you will be forced to judge someone by a principle to which you yourself do not conform.
For instance, being in a relationship with a cheater. But you ended up breaking up with him (after going through emotional turmoil and then reasoning it out rationally).
So I guess these situations would come down to getting over the emotional period, and once you're feeling more objective; being able to make a 'non-judgmental' decision, or as close to one as you can possibly make.
From what you said in the other postings, I would say that yes, you want to define yourself to an extent in order to have guidelines according to which you want to function. But you don't like setting strict principles, since you don't want to be judged according to these principles, and you also try to avoid judging others - since you hate double standards/ being a hypocrite in so doing.
Deletethe first pt you say is right. i think that my confusion about me is the problem. The other stuff, people judging me? No,I made a mistake when i mentioned that. i have gotten over that. I get ANNoYED if someone tells me i "should " do this or feel this because I "feel' a certain way. as if there is only a certain way to do things, like the self help idiots spouting formulas. They try to telll me i do disservice to my self and feelings because they do not understand, (and i do not say either) the nuances of my feelings. My feelings change a bunch from day to day anyway so these conversations with them are useless. i overshare with the wrong people time and time again. and lots of them are judgmental. I find many people are myself included soetimes. So I have learned to ignore them (as they should me, and i shut my mouth all the time) even though i make the mistake of listening .That is my bad. BUT there are way too many wrong people to talk to .
I do the best thing for me, yes. But idk, something is off. Maybe i am ultimately unhappy settling. Maybe i enjoy the drama turmoil of the decision making process. I have no fucking clue. I think i do not know how to take care of myself all the time, like i need a nanny to guide me and make decisions best for me.
I went through the emotions and made the decision with the narc/socio but back tracked with him. I took the rational decision and then back tracked. I broke it off and then wanted to win him back. But he did not want to play with me anymore and i was disappointed. That is sick. I did the right thing for me and then did not want to lose him. He never spoke to me again. I saw him in the street, he asked why i don't come say hello if i am in his neighborhood all the time,i say "what for?" all tough, he walks away, and then the next week i DO go to say hello and tell him if he ever wants to do a late night movie (he is lonely and i was at the time)and he never wanted to speak to me again. All because i made him feel bad about himself for as fucking minute. I would have been able to compartmentalize and had an interesting friend i could not trust, but noooooo, he had no interest in someone he could no longer seduce. Fucking narc. W H Y w O U L D I W A N T A DOUCHEBAG i can't trusr for a friend??? Because he is a novelty?? Because i am lonely?? Because I wanted him to love me even though i rejected him as mate material? What kind of a retard am i?
i know the answer. It is individual. We are all indviduals with things to offer. There as a reasion i went out with him in the first place and i simply wanted to prolong my relationship no matter where it ended up. I enjoyed his company, that is all. it is not sick to miss people.
Deleteis Leander another Monica version?
ReplyDeleteWhat made you obsessed with Monica, so now you find her anywhere?
DeleteWill you tell me something about her?
When I was a kid I tried to make sense of the many, many people out there. This is what I came up with: Could we possibly live in diverse characters one not knowing about the other? Somehow like the rebirth turned into some type of parallel string universe. In other word you could be me or I could be you and both of us could be Monica.
Monica is a brave soul.
DeleteMaybe we all want to see brave souls all around us. Maybe we search for ourselves in other people bec iI we can recognize courage in the other maybe we will see it in ourselves.
The inability to grasp contradictions, paradoxes, and shades of gray, have been reliable indicators of feeble-mindedness in my experience. I did not say 'stupidity,' because even highly intelligent people can be utterly pedantic at times (which I suspect weakens the intellect, ultimately).
ReplyDelete"I do not like to lie but I will somtimes pretend I am lying in order to give someone paranoia if they are pulling a fast one cheating. Is that the narcissistic way or the borderline way? Or is it the normal healthy way to handle a narcissistic douchebag?"
ReplyDeleteYou sound so lost and confused. You sound perfect for me :)
As far as exactly what your motivations are for doing what your doing you can probably figure out better on your own if you just look at the big picture in an honest way. I have taken many courses on psychology, always did research on it since a young age and always found it interesting. But I'm no psychologist, and in my experience even psychologists can't seem to figure out half of my fucking problems. As a matter of fact, if I go to 5 different psychologists and ask them "So what's the deal?" about some issue they will usually give me 5 totally different answers. Bottom line: You got to figure your own shit out is what it comes down to. Even if you talk to a psychologist, they can only determine things based on what you tell them, and if your as honest with yourself as you are with them you can start to figure out your shit. But it will take time. I suggest reading through research on whatever you think you may have, although dont be too quick to label yourself as this or that; having a few symptoms, or even many symptoms of something doesn't mean you actually have it.
LoL
DeleteI know you are joking with me, but if we ever met, you would not recognize me as a lost person.
I have been to shrinks and i know those things. I have had too many shrinks. I dont seek a diagnosis, I just want to see the separate incidents on individual basis to know how to proceed for peace. This place has helped me get to know and like my manipulative side. It's cool with me. I wasn't aware. I google around a bunch.
Thank you for your advice
Delete"I know you are joking with me, but if we ever met, you would not recognize me as a lost person."
DeleteAre you saying we can meet? I never would have though a website for sociopaths would become a great place to pick up women! LOL
well fancy that, someone here thinking they are sooooo attractive i was making a proposition lololololol
DeleteYou know what i meant. I come across confident a lot, and IF we ever met ,,at a social gathering of sw people say, you would not think i was the one with all the confusion. You would think i was Machempath or Zoe ....cards close to vest, calm graceful.
Then i would take you home and eat you up and noone would ever hear from you again.
Still want that date, sailor?
People are disappointed after they spend TIME with me.
Is it possible to become a sociopath due to traumatic events? Some say yes. Some say, you are born with it.
ReplyDelete"Is it possible to become a sociopath due to traumatic events? Some say yes. Some say, you are born with it."
DeleteI have often told people that a sociopath is something that is created to an extent - I do believe there are genes that at the very least predispose you to ASPD and what not, although I think they may not necessarily get expressed in all individuals with the genetic potential. More genetic research would have to be done on sociopaths (alot of sociopath research is junk) for me to really feel totally sure about how genetics and being a sociopath mix, although I do think there is a definite correlation.
However, in many ways, sociopaths are also created. This is not to say that someone who has no genetic potential for being a sociopath can become one given the right environment. But, even if you are a genuine sociopath from the day you are born, the environments and social conditionings you are exposed to, ESPECIALLY during early childhood significantly impact the development of your personality. If you were to clone a baby sociopath and put it into 5 totally different socioeconomic environments, I find it likely that they would turn out to seem like 5 totally different people. Sure, they would have some similarities, and if they are clones they will look the same, but if their environments are very different, that would effect them.
Moreover, most sociopaths have had fucked up childhoods. It's a fact. And the sociopaths that are most violent and scary pretty much always have very fucked up childhoods. I used to be beaten all the time by my sociopathic father, who would explain to the family that I misbehaved and was being punished. In reality, my brother would tell me on a weekly basis "if you just agree to shower with dad you wont get beat, you should just shower with him." My brother on the other hand never got beat because he showered with him. The beatings continued until I started hiding big wrenches in my bedroom at around the age of eight. I also continuosly fought and beat up on other kids as a child since I was taught violence was the way to solve problems - also, I feel like I was trying to toughen myself up to fight my father. Ever since I was 5 years old martial arts have been my main passion, and I have been able to defeat my father in hand to hand combat since age 12.
So, the question is, am I a sociopath because I inherited the trait from my father genetically? Or is it because of how he raised me? To be honest, I think that there's a mix of both nature and nurture, for anyone to think its 100% of either is a bit off...my childhood has influenced me in alot of ways, and the dynamics of the environment I was brought up in while very young have definitely deeply influenced my personality.
I guess one thing people should consider when studying the connection between genes and sociopaths is that even if the parents are also sociopaths, that does not mean the reason their kids are sociopaths is 100% genetic - most sociopathic parents probably create environments that are more likely to bring out latent sociopathic characteristics of their children.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThe more exposure I have to sociopaths, the more I see the personality structure as something that is adaptive in early years if an individual has an antagonistic upbringing. I'd wager that most revolutionaries and geniuses have quite a bit in common with the classic sociopath.
ReplyDeleteWhen you are young and smart and filled with suppressed rage at having been silenced by power addicted individuals who don't have the sort of elevated insight their power grab suggests that they do- it is a healthy adaptation to "fight the power". To say, "why always do it your way? why do you get to be the boss? what are you currently contributing to the system you feel you should dominate?"
If the world was made up of conforming do gooders, I doubt that the highest form of civilization would evolve beyond a feudal state, because no one would have the guts to say "The emperor has no clothes! Let's take him down!" Sociopathic leanings (fearlessness, selfishness, machiavellian behavior) are key ingredients in providing the motivation to wage a successful guerrilla campaign against a corrupt establishment.
But here's the thing- sociopathic traits that are acted out in the early twenties have a far better chance of producing positive outcomes than a rigid sociopathic personality structure. (Ironic that I'd use the word rigid here, but let me explain). Young adults have more fluid identities because they are learning who they really are. They have more energy to fight battles. They are more motivated to find novel sexual partners. They haven't consistently experienced the consequences other people face in the wake of "asshole" behavior.
At a certain point, the sociopathic boldness that leads to early success in the game of life runs smack into accumulating evidence that the culture/community is starting to figure out that you exploit trusting individuals and can not be relied upon to stick around when the going gets tough. This also coincides with lessening attractiveness and no longer having the newest ideas, so your social edge has diminished.
Suddenly nobody wants you around. When this happens, the aging sociopath has two choices. They can embark on a life quest to hopscotch through different communities they are forced to leave when they burn bridges, or they can consciously develop a prosocial skill set that endears them to fellow members of their community who recognize the ongoing value of having this person in their midst.
Sociopathic wiring is a moral neutral unless a person makes a life of "gaming others". The ability to think strategically and compartmentalize emotion predisposes a person to being good at gaming others. There is a time and place for everything- and youth is when these traits are best explored- especially in the context of rigid social structures that inflict trauma. But if a person doesn't grow beyond their ability to "fight the power" and "game the system", they become a con artist. They never produce anything of substance that they can develop a positive self concept from because they can't invest in anything beyond short term self interest. At this point, any advantage from the ability to engage in Machiavellian reasoning is outweighed by the sad reality that the sociopath is truly a rebel without a cause. The endpoint of a personality dominated by sociopathic traits is an individual who suffers continually diminishing returns on all efforts because they are no longer as attractive and energetic as the next generation of sociopaths in the making.
"The more exposure I have to sociopaths, the more I see the personality structure as something that is adaptive in early years if an individual has an antagonistic upbringing. I'd wager that most revolutionaries and geniuses have quite a bit in common with the classic sociopath."
DeleteYou are wise beyond your years :)
"When you are young and smart and filled with suppressed rage at having been silenced by power addicted individuals who don't have the sort of elevated insight their power grab suggests that they do- it is a healthy adaptation to "fight the power". To say, "why always do it your way? why do you get to be the boss? what are you currently contributing to the system you feel you should dominate?""
If you read the story of my childhood (in response to the post right before yours) you can see how my childhood fits this explanation perfectly. My father is a crazy control freak sociopath. He regularly beat me to try to get me to submit to him, but I have a strong internal locus of control and never let people dominate me since a young age. I was always caused trouble in school, was the class clown, beat all the other kids up, and when my teachers would do things to punish me, I would always find ways to make the punishment not worth their time. For example, one teacher said I disrupted class too much and so they had the school psychologist sit next to me in class all day. In response, I actually did the things they hated most with a much greater frequency, and blackmailed them by saying until the school shrink went back to his office i would continue to be more disruptive than I ever was. Result was, this sociopath 14 year old got what he wanted and they sent the high school shrink back to his office, and then I continued to sleep during most of the classes, or make the teacher look like a fool in front of the class.
The fact that I hate authority and submitting to power is probably why every once in a while I crave extreme sexual domination, and get into really hardcore shit, because in my normal life I simply do not allow any power to dominate me without my consent, including the government. Psychologically, having a very alpha outlook can be very stressful, which is probably why people with type A personalities have a shorter than average life span. Heavy lies the crown sort of thing. But yeah, being totally dominated sexually gives me this huge release that I simply don't normally get because I rarely become subservient to anything. Some things I will tolerate in exchange for certain things, some things I do not. And if the power does something in response to me not obeying them, I look at it as an attack and then I get defensive. Sometimes this defense is very overt, other times extremely covert and sneaky.
type A typically frequent dom houses. I am Type A
DeleteUkan said Borderlines like domination. THey aren't all the same, and i have some f that criteria but overlap with yours a bit. I like sexual domination too.
Are you female?
Male. I also like dominating, but there is a release that submission gives me as well. Most of the time I prefer to be more on the dominating side. I have strict roles for each partner though.
Delete"If the world was made up of conforming do gooders, I doubt that the highest form of civilization would evolve beyond a feudal state, because no one would have the guts to say "The emperor has no clothes! Let's take him down!" Sociopathic leanings (fearlessness, selfishness, machiavellian behavior) are key ingredients in providing the motivation to wage a successful guerrilla campaign against a corrupt establishment. "
ReplyDeleteI do agree that sociopaths often start revolutions, and I do have very revolutionary leanings. So, they may take down corrupt establishments, but I'd say sociopaths also often setup corrupt establishments as well. I come from a family of royal blood, and some of my relatives as well as our close friends our very high on the totem pole. My father is a doctor and very high up in the medical field, my uncle a lawyer and former attorney general, his best friend is CEO of CitiGroup, my stepbrothers uncle is one of the 50 richest men in America, etc. Our family is also heavily ridden with mental illness, and sociopaths in particular.
Sociopaths have run the world for a long time, and seeing how my family and people like them influence the world is really fucked up. I am more of the robin hood type of sociopath. The word Ndrangheta means a hero of honor and virtue, and it is the name for the most powerful Italian mafia group in the world. The village in Italy named after my family is right next to the international meeting place for all of the bosses. However, over time mafia groups have become more focused on being business based than family based (although the ndrangheta is more family based than the other 2 major groups, La Cosa Nostra and the Camorra). I do believe in business, but I have a robin hood mentality that the organization was originally founded upon. My family doesn't like this, especially since i'm the first born son of my generation and therefore my decisions hold alot of weight. Instead of leading a movement towards actually creating a more balanced and efficient society, they would rather have me continue to help the current show go on. So, even though some sociopaths, such as myself, are revolutionary, the higher you go up the social totem pole, the higher the frequency of sociopaths. You simply won't have what it takes to be the man behind the curtain if you have normal emotions and are a normal human being, there is too much corruption for that.
As someone who is born into a position of privilege, you will likely get away with sociopathic behavior much longer than the average Joe or Jane. But as time passes, your likely trajectory will be towards malignant narcissism that you are able to get away with because you are at the top of the food chain. From what I understand, it's hard to find ongoing life satisfaction with this personality structure because all pursuits of pleasure are made boring because there is no real effort needed to help you get what you want.
DeleteI'm glad you identify yourself as someone with an internal locus of control. You might actually be someone who is able to use their gifts to produce something of substance rather than use the accumulated wealth/power you inherit as a means of enabling a pattern of behavior that becomes unsustainable for most other people. Just because you can do things that are pleasurable in the short term does not mean that they will contribute to your own long term well being.
You seem very bright and like you have a good head on your shoulders. I wish you luck.
One more thought:
DeleteIt would be a waste of a good mind if you followed the path of least resistance and let your sociopathic tendencies find an endpoint in malignant narcissism. Sure, you'd be powerful, but any greatness that might be possible for you today will wither into something far more ordinary as the years pass and your physical and mental abilities inevitably decline.
The biggest waste of a smart individual with sociopathic wiring comes when they allow the chip on their shoulder to drive all future actions. This plays out in taking an overtly hostile and exploitative position in all relationships, when there are times the sociopath would be better served by a cooperative alliance. So many potential opportunities are squandered this way.
A life spent pursuing power for the sake of power is the ultimate exercise in meaningless. Let's say the individual does achieve all the power- then the dilemma of Alexander the Great intrudes because you have conquered the whole world and there is nothing else to do. There is no more motivation to achieve anything. You are simply waiting to die.
The smart sociopath has a solid internal locus of control, from which specific personal goals can be generated. Then, the sociopathic gifts of Machiavellian reasoning and emotional compartmentalization can be used in service of achieving the specific sort of powers that would be most likely to ensure the maximum effectiveness in realizing those goals. If the goal is simply personal power, the individual will never achieve true greatness because they have confused the means with the end.
"But here's the thing- sociopathic traits that are acted out in the early twenties have a far better chance of producing positive outcomes than a rigid sociopathic personality structure. (Ironic that I'd use the word rigid here, but let me explain). Young adults have more fluid identities because they are learning who they really are. They have more energy to fight battles. They are more motivated to find novel sexual partners. They haven't consistently experienced the consequences other people face in the wake of "asshole" behavior.
ReplyDeleteAt a certain point, the sociopathic boldness that leads to early success in the game of life runs smack into accumulating evidence that the culture/community is starting to figure out that you exploit trusting individuals and can not be relied upon to stick around when the going gets tough. This also coincides with lessening attractiveness and no longer having the newest ideas, so your social edge has diminished.
Suddenly nobody wants you around. When this happens, the aging sociopath has two choices. They can embark on a life quest to hopscotch through different communities they are forced to leave when they burn bridges, or they can consciously develop a prosocial skill set that endears them to fellow members of their community who recognize the ongoing value of having this person in their midst. "
In many ways, the younger sociopaths do have advantages. But based on my experiences of conflicts with my father, the aged sociopath may have resources at their disposal the young one does not. For example, even though my dad has no actual FRIENDS, and is very lonely, he is well connected as well as very rich. He has used his money and power in his conflicts with me. For example, when I began extorting him for money by threatening to tell the police about a guy he wacked, he got a restraining order on me and also used his connections to have me sent to a mental institution that he is on the board of directors for. The shrink would ask me what was bothering me, and I told him my family was abusive. He kept telling me I was delusional, until one day I finally said "I will just leave the issues with my family between me and my family." to which the shrink responded "Great! I think your condition is improving, and you may be released soon." I was released from the institution the next day.
So therefore, I have become increasingly sneaky and calculating. My father certainly does have some power over me, although back then I actually depended on him. His arrogance really is getting the best of him, he really is calling my bluff and thinks nothing will happen to him. Now that I'm no longer dependent on him, he's walking on rather thin ice. My plans are already beginning to unfold as planned, especially since the rest of the family has become sick of him too. On top of that, he does not support anyone except for his new wife, who everybody hates. For some reason he thinks he can make enemies with every person who has dirt on him and still be ok.
I think one positive trait i have that most sociopaths don't is a sense of humility. I can be a little cocky at times, but I have always placed a ton of emphasis on the importance of being humble if you wish to succeed in most things, I am the talk soft but carry a big stick kind of guy. In many ways I am totally different from my father, I guess I'm part of the generation of upgraded sociopaths :)
The description of your father perfectly illustrates the downside of a formerly sociopathic personality who has morphed into a malignant narcissist. Humility (by that I mean a realistic appraisal of your own strengths and weaknesses not the appearance of being self effacing) will be your greatest weapon in not experiencing a similar downward trajectory when you have reached his age and station in life.
ReplyDelete"The description of your father perfectly illustrates the downside of a formerly sociopathic personality who has morphed into a malignant narcissist. Humility (by that I mean a realistic appraisal of your own strengths and weaknesses not the appearance of being self effacing) will be your greatest weapon in not experiencing a similar downward trajectory when you have reached his age and station in life. "
DeleteYou hit the nail right on the head mach, I have realized all of these things a long time ago. The teachings of Zen have really helped me alot in this department. Also, my father never got heavily into martial arts (he said he learned a little Tae Kwan Do in college but I train with professional fighters on a regular basis and have been training since I could walk), If you train with people who don't suck, you will be humbled at some point during your training. Nobody is born the best fighter ever (name one newborn baby that could defeat any grown man), and even with alot of "natural talent" you will not be as skilled as someone with natural talent who has spent over 10 years of their life sharpening their skills. Lately I have been training a little less, although I usually aim for 20-30 hours of training per week. My teacher often tells me I overtrain, so if anything I should chill (especially considering how intense I get sometimes). And although most people who show up at our gym can't even land a strike on me for at least their first few months, I also realize that I have never been able to ever effectively land a strike on my teacher when he has done sparring exercises with me. Ever. The man is literally so skilled at combat it is unreal. So even though I can beat the crap out of most people, realizing I can't even land a strike on my teacher balances out any arrogance that could develop.
I try to always keep a beginners mind. If you always have the attitude like you just started and there is still a million things to learn about something, you'll keep growing. Especially in something like martial arts or computer programming or cooking where even a whole lifetime of study and practice can't bring COMPLETE mastery (especially since those types of things are continuing to evolve and change) once you think you know everything you start looking for more knowledge.
There is a book I like called Zen Mind, Beginners Mind. I think Zen is particularly good for sociopaths since it is not based primarily upon emotion. Even though they do place some emphasis upon compassion, you can act in a way that is compassionate or think in a compassionate way even if you cant FEEL compassion. It's strange how I have to act based purely off a mental concept/idea because I know that I lack the emotions people have to regulate their behavior. Although it feels normal to me, I know it's strange because I would be an idiot to not notice that some things about me are a little quirky.
I like your thinking here. Personally, I'm partial to the Stoic philosophers, Epictetus in particular- also Marcus Aurelius- but there's a lot of overlap in that both traditions address the cancer of the ego.
DeleteI'm curious- what do you want to do with your life? It seems like you have a good mind and the resources to make the most of it.
Only bits- and a long time ago. Is there any section in particular you find to be particularly helpful?
ReplyDelete"I like your thinking here. Personally, I'm partial to the Stoic philosophers, Epictetus in particular- also Marcus Aurelius- but there's a lot of overlap in that both traditions address the cancer of the ego.
ReplyDeleteI'm curious- what do you want to do with your life? It seems like you have a good mind and the resources to make the most of it. "
I never studied western philosophy too much - I took classes on it in college but I have devoted alot of my life to not just the study but also the PRACTICE of eastern spirituality, philosophy, and religion. Ch'an was created when Buddhism came to China and mixed with Taoism, and when Ch'an came to Japan they called it Zen. Ch'an just never became the common term but that is the original name. For some reason eastern thought always seemed much more complete and correct than what I've read from most western philosophers. And there is an esotericness to it that I really love, western philosophy doesn't have the esoteric leanings as much. At the same time, even though it has ideas which seem esoteric, most things in Zen make sense, and when they dont, you go scrambling around trying to solve these paradoxes that bring you on crazy journeys. These paradoxical journeys can be especially interesting on psychedelic drugs.
As far as what do I want to do with my life, as stated earlier i recently graduated college. I'm trying to do well with my IT career, I don't need a ton of money just enough to get by and have fun sometimes. And I already make plenty of money helping out the family so I'll be okay. Ultimately though, I dont want to just go to work every day then come home my whole life. I really do feel like a spiritual warrior of sorts, like someone who was put here to at the very least end the lives of people who really suck. I want to change the world. Although I think instead of violence, the key to my success would lie in the minds of the people.
Almost all of the worlds resources is controlled by an extremely small portion of the population. What the 99% of people don't realize is they actually are much more powerful than the top 1%. The top 1% only have the power that they have because other people give them their power. Without the masses, they are nothing - the masses IS their power. Without obedience, their orders cannot be obeyed, and they then have no power.
When it is worth it for the masses to conform, that's one thing. But once the upper classes start crossing the line, it becomes perfectly worth it for the lower classes to rebel. The main issue separating modern times from the past is that they have everyone reliant upon their system. For example, most food people eat they buy from a grocery store with food that is imported, not food grown locally. If food riots broke out because of an economic collapse, studies show that the average supermarket is cleared out within 6 hours, and then they dont restock it during a food riot because people will just steal it. Therefore, the masses must learn to be more self sufficient in regards to their basic needs, otherwise they will not be fit to survive what is to come.
"Only bits- and a long time ago. Is there any section in particular you find to be particularly helpful? "
ReplyDeleteAll of them
So my take away is: you are a humanitarian?
ReplyDeleteDefine humanitarian
ReplyDeleteBefore you even define it, I guess you could say I'm a humanitarian in the sense that I believe in giving the people what they want. To an extent, of course.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that if you have a goal, it is to make sure resources are used more effectively to empower all people, not just the wealthy. It also seems that you have a bit of the "avenging angel" in your personality.
ReplyDeleteAn observation: while both motivations are rooted in your desire to better humanity, you will compromise your ability to act on the legitimate business/political front if you are associated with any form of organized crime. To act as one who would pull the trigger is antithetical to being one who is able to lead any sort of "legitimate" business. Given your obvious ambition and potential, it might be worth considering the fact you do not want to have any skeletons (pun intended) in your closet. Violent acts committed as a young man often lead to the undoing of that same man 20 years later. I am not passing judgement, but I do have a fair amount of political exposure and am all too aware that if a reputation is tarnished, many doors of opportunity are closed forever.
Your observations are correct. Although my family is already very successful in the legitimate business realm, I won't get into details about which businesses we run but they do rather well. I am exploring my own niches within these businesses as well, and also exploring other niches. I also am currently developing software that I plan on patenting and selling - down the line I may rather just sell the rights or at least a percentage of the company in exchange for having someone else run it.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I live in Rhode Island and the politics here are very corrupt. For a long time it has been dominated by Italian mafia groups - in the past it was more by the local Winter Hill gang (which still exists and operates) but now more international groups are on the rise. White collar crime is not noticed as much but is actually a major modern pursuit of organized crime in rhode island (as far as Italian groups are concerned). Asian gangs have also been growing, and there has always been black and hispanic gangs here. But at the end of the day, the Italians run rhode island - they make up the largest ethnic group of the entire state and the social dynamics of the state create an environment in which organized crime is inevitable. If you want further details, I can explain. But even in terms of law enforcement and business and politics, some mafia families have alot of eyes and iron fists to protect their interests. And granted, some people do get screwed over, but the main objective is to accomplish the aims of the group, If you have little experience with organized crime you probably only know much about people who get caught. I think it's very likely that many of them never get caught until the day that they die. And even when some do get caught, money talks in places like Rhode Island. I've seen it.
Very interesting. My experience with corruption is more political and financial services related. I understand the "old boy networks" . My biggest observation is that it's a very closed system, with little tolerance for newcomers. (politics less so, but definitely financial services). I divorced a man who was a crown prince within a "WASP mafia" sort of family, which is to say- plenty of sociopathic ruining of threatening outsiders and rebellious insiders takes place, but always from a "civilized distance". Murder is not the MO, and nobody literally dirties their hands. Smear campaigns and corporate sabotage are far less risky and equally effective.
ReplyDeleteI don't know which side of business you will end up on. It seems like you have a foot in both worlds. If you are open to advice, here is some: you can always participate in organized crime, but if you are too closely linked to criminal elements you will automatically be excluded from all organizational hierarchies that position themselves as legitimate. You must protect your reputation and avoid getting your hands dirty or you will never be perceived as anything other than a glorified goon.
I am quite cynical about the financial services world and think it is perhaps even less honorable than better organized crime families (where loyalty is rewarded)- so please don't interpret my caution about guarding your reputation as moralism. It's not. It's Machiavellian. If you haven't read "the Prince" yet, please do. I am not telling you to take any path, only to recognize that the financial services industry pulls the strings on everything. They are the true puppet masters. Be careful not to alienate them because an intelligent young gun who gets "too ambitious" will find that all of his roads are blocked.
Use your sociopathic traits to study and blend in with this crowd superficially, and you will be far less likely to encounter outright antagonism. Feel free to despise them, but never fail to conceal your distaste. It's best to gain trust by slipping in under the radar and letting yourself be underestimated than giving off any hint of being a "player". Keep the self defense stuff private. Let your strengths be known only to you... no need to suck up to this crowd and become part of it- just invest moderate effort in making your existence known in a non threatening fashion by living in a good neighborhood in Boston and joining a few community organizations. It will serve as an insurance policy 20 years down the road.
Good luck.
You have very nice qualities Ndrangheta. I am the one you said you would like to try sleeping with one person longer than one night stands..
ReplyDeleteI hope you get to try that one day. After being with such a harsh parent and toughing your childhood all out on your own, you should be given the chance to rest your head on someone while you sleep,without a baseball bat under your bed.
You are young enough.
If I can do it, even if i am always in conflict about it, given your determination, you will be able to try it no problem. I hope you get that experience even if it isn't your cup of tea in the long run.
For the honeymoon period anyway, it's as sweet as sweet can be.
I appreciate your advice regarding the financial system. I'm aware I could go more into that field if I wanted a "quick fix" in terms of money and power, but at the end of the day most people in the financial sector are still puppets and pawns. Sure, you may feel like a puppet master, and to some extent you are, but unless you are at the tippity top you have puppet masters controlling what you do as well.
ReplyDeleteThe United States currency is getting super fucked right now. And it's not like the financial people are simply unaware. The man who; built a bunker with my family (which is there in case there is some sort of social catastrophe) invented derivative banking, and he has talked about some of the coming problems from the fallout of such things.
I totally understand that certain things could compromise my ability to act on a "legitimate" front (even though as you said, alot of legitimate fronts are more sinister than illegitimate ones). However, I take very calculated risks, and I'm a meticulous planner. The things we have been doing to make money we have been doing for a very long time, and it's extremely rare for any of us to get caught. When any of us do get caught, various influences are used to minimize the harm from what happened and due to the large amount of connections that we have who are open minded towards illegitimate people, even the ones that are more well known in terms of their criminal reputation sometimes do better than anyone else in the family in the business world. It's sometimes easier to keep a business afloat when you have millions of dollars of cash to launder through it - and if that's the case it doesn't really matter as much if every politician wants to be your friend or not because you already have more than you need. And as far as getting your own hands dirty, that's something that's heavily frowned upon in my family. I've never killed someone with my bare hands, although I have often fantasized about how amazing it would feel to strangle someone to death, watch their face as the life drains out of them. And most of the deadly weapons I do own are silent. Guns are too loud and are in my opinion a poor choice of weapon for home defense - guns are more fitting out and about on the street where you need something with range. Moreover, if you pop off some shots at your house you can be pretty sure the boys in blue might be there real quick. This could be extremely problematic depending on the circumstances.
And I do agree that even if I was to destroy the financial sector, outright alienating myself from it is not the most effective way. You are right in that an internal based attack based on slow gathering of intel and an effective but silent strategy could work, especially since I have been writing computer programs since i was 12 years old and could much more easily do some crazy attack on a bank if it was an inside job.
ReplyDeleteAs stated earlier though, even though a few big scores here and there would be nice, at the end of the day it's not just alot of money or something like that what I want. You seem to be more focused on actually serving your own drives for certain resources and what not. I have that to an extent, but especially from all my years of Zen I really don't even care much about what i want sometimes. You are correct in that I have an "avenging angel' in me. It's a very robotic sort of personality that simply has one aim and is willing to do anything to get there. And as I've said, I don't want to just do a job and come home, I literally want to change the entire world as we know it. I know I'm unlikely to be completely successful in accomplishing all of my goals regarding influence over society, but even when I die it will be carried on by other people who are on the same wavelength. But. if I am successful, the people who currently run the financial system may not have nearly as much power in the future as they do now. I know it all sounds hard to imagine, and it will take alot of time, although many of my objectives are being completed on time, so I'm confident the goals of my movement will continue to accelerate in terms of their satisfaction. The main thing is strength in numbers, although there will need to be a more hidden, secretive element that most members do not know about which may serve to enforce the goals and ideologies of the party. Having been born into a core mafia family, I understand how to do things like this.
I have a crazy suggestion, but I am making it to address the logjam of motivation you seem to be bumping up against. It doesn't sound like you have any issues with competence or strategic thinking. You biggest issue seem to be: what is the point of it all. If I may be so bold it seems that while you realistically understand that you have the tools and self motivation to make something of yourself, you are haunted by the bigger question of WHY? You seem to be struggling with the hopelessness of nihilism.
DeleteThere's a book called "The Road Less Traveled" by a guy named M. Scott Peck that might speak to this specific frustration. He was a Buddhist when he began writing it, but then moved towards a Judeo Christian perspective. If you see it at the book store you might be tempted to dismiss it because it is in the self help section.
I read this book for the first time at 16, and it was life changing for me. I read it every couple of years (I am 39 now). It will be very different than anything you regularly encounter, but the fact you are drawn to Zen Buddhism makes me think you might like this book.
For what it's worth, your capacity for self examination is remarkable. I hope you have a satisfying life.
Thank you Mach. In some ways I do have some nihilistic aspects to my thinking. However, I'm not entirely a nihilist, which will get to my next point and answer your question of WHY
DeleteIf I was indeed a total nihilist, I would think that nothing has any meaning or value. This is not the case. Just in the same way that a samurai would rather die an honorable death than live a dishonorable life, I believe that our life's meaning is determined by ourselves to a large extent. The purpose of everyone's life does not have to always be the same, although many individuals have some sense of purpose. What purposes your life is used to satisfy is one of the major aspects of your life's meaning. The word "meaning" has a similar meaning to the word "definition", or how something is defined. Although many aspects of ourselves and our lives are outside our control, our will and intentions are able to shape things in ways in which our free will can give life meaning.
I find it interesting that you recommend I read a book written by a Buddhist turned Christian. My religious views are actually Christian, although I believe the way Christianity is believed and practiced on a mainstream level is way far off from what Jesus intended. My Buddhist practices and contemplations are what led me back to Christianity; when I first encountered Buddhism I was an athiest, and then started developing an interest in the Occult. I dropped the ahteism and then the occult and got very serious with Buddhism, which led me back to a Christian based view with heavy Buddhist influences.
So, as far as the WHY - I have always felt since a young child that I'm here for a reason. Ever since a young child, I have always felt like a warrior of sorts. Ultimately, I'm not fundamentally a warrior for any particular group. I view myself as a spiritual warrior, a warrior of God. I'm not saying that I'm perfect or that I don't sin, although you hit the nail on the head with the "avenging angel" comment, I'm not perfect but I have a strong urge to set things straight.
I also feel alot of it has to do with the fact that I am very territorial. It's not so much that I want to be a world leader, it's as if I already feel like this is MY land, even though I happily share it with others. Just like the cliche idea of someone doing something in a mafia controlled territory, and then the mafia boss saying something like "He did WHAT?!?! In MY town?!?!" Even though I don't emotionally feel sorrow for the people who are being manipulated by the system, I'm programmed to destroy the traitors and deceivers of our kind. The 'Ndrangheta was created under robin hood ideals mainly by members of the peasant class, and was originally designed to help protect it's members from the corruption of the aristocracy at the time. The organizational structure of this particular group is much more fit to survive than the other groups, which is probably why it has become the most powerful group, and they are much more powerful than the aristocracy of Calabria at this point (Calabria is the region of Italy that they originated in). Some years back, the Vice President of Calabria tried to make strong moves against the Ndrangheta, but was assassinated. In other words, even if you are at the top of the political totem pole in Calabria, you are not ultimately above the Ndrangheta on the social totem pole, especially since the Ndrangheta's activities in Italy alone account for roughly 5% of the entire country's GDP, and this figure does not include their legitimate business operations or operations outside of the country.
So anyways, I feel like there are many social injustices in existence. The WHY is simply because I feel obligated to do it, it's my life's mission and I feel like it will produce the kinds of changes in the world that will benefit the majority of the population, and even the people who are disadvantaged by the change would still be more privileged than others.
DeleteI have met other heroic sociopaths. I really think that it's an interesting subtype. One example is a friend of mind who spent 10 years in prison on attempted murder charges. He used to get information about sexual predators (which you can find easily online, such as their name, address, etc, so people can be aware of who to watch out for) and then would stalk them. If he deemed that they were still continuing to abuse children, he would confront them and give them the choice of death or turning themselves into the police. He thought he had finished the job on this one guy, but apparently he didn't since the guy survived and told the police what happened, which landed my friend behind bars. On the bright side, the guards always let him know when a child predator entered the cell block and he would always beat the into a pulp. He never got into detail, but I told him about my childhood and he said that he was sexually abused, and I believe this is his way of getting revenge. Also, since he's aware of how fucked up it is, he doesn't think it's something people should do and wants to punish people for their wrong doings.
" they are much more powerful than the aristocracy of Calabria at this point"
ReplyDeleteI would like to make a quick comment about this sentence I wrote. I generally don't look over my writing to edit it, unless it's for something I'm doing for work. My rough drafts tend to be pretty good, although you will probably notice somewhat different styles of communication from me depending on what drugs I'm on or not on and whether or not I'm in a rush or frustrated or something like that. But anyways...
As far as that sentence goes, the 'Ndrangheta are as a whole much more powerful than the aristocracy of Calabria, although at this point much of the aristocracy is either married into the group (marrying a member), originally part of it (born into it), although they are at least as likely to simply be an associate of them or at least stay out of the group's way. Moreover, research by government agencies on the 'Ndrangheta shows that in comparison to other criminal groups they have a strong tendency to gradually monopolize every territory they enter over time. I think there are several reasons for this and I won't bore you with them, but if you're interested I can explain a couple of basic things you could already learn from doing some research and using some thinking. It's amazing how much information there is available about various secret societies these days. I feel like the internet has made pretty much all secret societies a little less secret. Generally, people don't entirely expose things in ways that they could easily be compromised (unless they are just fucking stupid) but information is much more open and shared in modern times. Quite simply, word just gets around quickly. The ability for people to post things anonymously on the internet allows them to publicly talk about things they wouldn't talk about to most people face to face. Granted, you don't want to say anything that would directly lead to an arrest or even a search warrant, so you have to be wise. But even in an anonymous context (and technically, the internet is not really anonymous, it just appears to be) there isn't much reason to go into much more detail than information you can already find publicly on the subject. There is a high level of secrecy expected by families like mine, so even though I do discuss some of my family related issues with other people, ti's always in a very shadowy way, even if I trust you and have known you for years. Even the way my whole family interacts about certain things has always been very shadowy - almost like the way women often like to drop subtle hints and not tell you flat out what the deal is. I wouldn't say it's so much a beat around the bush sort of thing, I guess you could say it's just a more symbolic, secretive and mysterious method of communication.
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ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteWhy do you believe there is a battle for my soul in particular?
ReplyDeleteI am willing to meet you. I have not seen you physically, so I have no idea what your looks are like, but I find the way you communicate particularly attractive.
If you want to go so far out of your way to meet me, why not come down my way so I can take you out for a bite to eat?
And before I meet you, can you at least tell me a little about yourself? I have already wrote volumes about myself.
I actually find it very interesting you offered to meet me. Earlier this morning I was already contemplating asking if you would like to meet, since I remember you saying I should move to Boston (this caused me to assume you are a Bostonian). I figured you would think I was some sketchy creep though.
ReplyDeleteAnd honestly, after everything you have read about myself, and the fact that you know I am a sociopath, why would you be so interested in meeting me in particular?
Moreover, if you are interested in exercise I would particularly like to meet you at the martial arts class I go to in Boston's Chinatown. I used to train up there 3 days a week although these past 2 months I have been very busy doing things for the family.
no that will not work.
ReplyDeleteI am not trying to be difficult, but I have a belief that if we are supposed to meet in person it will be apparent to you.
This I can tell you:
I am female.
I do not seek any sort of a sexual relationship with you.
I am not titillated by flirting with "evil".
But-
My spirit says-
be good to this individual. Not in a condescending way, in a respectful way. Be a harbor in his tempest and that will be the sum total of thins. Provide a safe time/place to consider options in a nonjudgmental fashion. Whatever choices need to be made in his life are a mystery to me and it's important to remain free of a sentimental sense that might compel me to take on battles that are his alone to fight.
I do not have the answers to the very deep and dangerous questions you are wrestling with. There is no sense on my end that ongoing communication between us needs to happen. But I know on a deep level that I need to make myself open to being a port in your storm. You are wrestling with some very dark influences. But perhaps my willingness to meet with you signals that you are not alone, and your choices in this situation will carry an echo that is far more significant than you or I can comprehend.
So- come or don't come. But know that my prayers are with you. And that I am in the last pew, left hand side, in a red dress.
I apologize for coming off in a sexual way. I was pretty positive you had no sexual interest in me, especially considering you asked to meet me at a church. If you asked to come to a rave and party all night on ecstasy with me, then I would probably assume such a thing. Although I had to at least vocalize the fact that even before you mentioned meeting i was already contemplating such a thing - the main reason for that is I notice you have a genuine interest in ME. Most people don't really get to see me, and the few that do are usually to afraid to get seriously involved with me, although there are countless people who prefer to remain in touch since they benefit from our relationships. However, I have noticed that although people put me at the top of their list for many things, particularly since I'm well connected, intelligent, skilled, and down for whatever, people definitely avoid really letting me into the more private areas of their lives most of the time, and I let few people into mine.
DeleteHowever, I've said more about myself on these postings than I have to most people whom I know, because of the anonymous nature of the postings. The fact that the woman who started this website chooses to remain anonymous simply reinforces the fact that we like to keep to ourselves in some ways. Although I've had social successes, I have had many social failures from my sociopathic way of being and I can tell people look at me differently - and many of these people know much less than the information you possess about me. So, the fact that you not only accept who i am, but for some reason have some sort of attraction (obviously it's not sexual, at least definitely not consciously, but there is something there that attracts you to me in some way) and interest in me. Sociopaths are prone to becoming extremely lonely, and even though we have trouble caring about people, when even your own family does not truly care about you it is frustrating to realize. I always used to joke with my friends "They should make a board game called Mafia with a catch phrase on the box "MAFIA - The Game Where Your Own Family Might Have You Wacked!"
But anyways... it's okay that you don't have any sexual interest in me. It's likely I may have found you to be an unsuitable match for sex upon meeting anyway, although it's something I would have been open to if the vibes were right. The hardest part through is not finding women physically attractive enough (sociopaths tend to be less picky with alot of things most other people are picky about when it comes to sex), but it's very difficult to find anyone who can keep up with me. A few hours after we start having sex, my partner is tired and needs to sleep, while i want to keep going for another 8 hours only taking breaks to pee and drink water/ But anyways, even though I'm willing to meet you in a church, I would eventually like to at least do something fun with you. Isn't there anything you do that's fun and exciting besides sex? Almost all of my relationships have nothing sexual about them, but I don't want our interactions to be super boring.
Another question I have for you is: are you yourself a sociopath? If not, do you actually have any psychological issues that you know of? How did you stumble on this site, what attracts you to it and why do you post on here?
I'm assuming when you say 10am, you mean each Sunday, correct?
A few hours after we start having sex, my partner is tired and needs to sleep, while i want to keep going for another 8 hours only taking breaks to pee and drink water/ But anyways
Deleteso if you start at 10 pm, and you go till they poop out....idk.11? then you are saying that you will be ready to go all night till 7 am. and then what? do you go back to sleep the AM away or do you go for a country breakfast with all the trimmings?
It's important to know what the day after looks like
Depends. If I was sober I would probably want something to eat, although if I was up on drugs all night to enable me to have better sex then I will probably be really drained and just want to sleep. Even if you were just laying there on your back the whole time, if you just finished with getting fucked by me for 8 hours you would probably want to chill for a bit.
DeleteEight hours is a long time. Why do you like to fuck for so many hours? Is it your humanitarian streak? lol Or the drugs do that?
DeleteWhen i was a young girl and fell in love with someone who ultimately broke my heart, I told my Dad "But he told me he loved me". I guess I must have told him that this was said in bed, or he figured it out, or he assumed or something. (The guy told it to me not only in bed, but anyway) My Dad just said "lots of people say things in bed"
The other night i was with my lover, and even though i usually don't feel safe and warm mentally because of the insecurity and trust issues, I let myself go in my head not only down below, and i started saying i love you with my eyes closed. It was purring out of me over and over and over. I was really stoned. I never ever thought I could/would do that. Somehow it didn't seem fair or polite with people who might get put off (like narcissists do) or with people you don't feel you are going to love forever. but maybe half the world feels like my father does and saying it in bed there are no rules. I decided i was not going to think about anything. I loved doing it. it felt like it was for me not him. My eyes were closed and I was high.
I've never done drugs to make sex more intense, but i can see what i have been missing.
Cocaine definitely makes me last alot longer. However, too much cocaine makes a man unable to keep an erection so I have to do lower doses for that. Vaginal and anal stimulation are actually much more pronounced on cocaine than penile stimulation, which is why it definitely increases the pleasure of a woman more than a man, and that's also why the only time I'm willing to let a woman stimulate or penetrate me anally (with a toy or whatever) is when I'm on cocaine.
DeleteHowever, even while not on cocaine I still have sex for at least a few hours. As far as being "stoned" though, if you were just smoking pot that doesn't effect sex anything like how cocaine effects sex. Sex n pot is very boring compared to sex n cocaine.
One thing I do find interesting is almost all of the posters on this site seem to be women. I never knew sociopath websites would turn into chick magnets. Maybe I should start a dating website for sociopaths? You could setup a profile either as a Sociopath or a Sociopath Lover. LOL
Oh I feel like every nerve is opened inside me with pot. I feel like on heroine or sthg. I can't imagine coke doing better, but one day I'll try coke with sex. I can be a tightly wound person and I already have hypomania, so piling coke on top..idk. I like the pot.
DeleteI was with a man who couldn't do a thing on the coke. He was an addict.. very disappointing.
If you started a dating site for sociopaths, you could partner up with the FBI. Then you'd be doing your avenging angel thing whilst securing hot socio-lover sex.
I will assist you ....lol in exchange for a very high salary under the table, and of course hot socio sex.
You can't know for sure what sex anyone is here. I would not put any male/female labels on anyone.
DeleteIt is good you will meet the Machempath. I imagine her with her 4 kids hanging on her, but they are respectful, watching her smoking a thin cigar, as she reads the secret bible pages her ancestors unearthed.
So your interested in some hot socio sex? What do you look for in a man? Where are you from?
DeleteWow, not exactly. I just like to flirt with the devil.
DeleteId be too afraid to fall for another sociopath. I have had a few experiences with narcissists and people who have left me directly after I attached....well I leave them then come back ...it is dramatic for me and destabilizes me. Going to bed with a sociopath would just be asking for trouble again.
The next best thing is using my imagination. I do enjoy the thought of submitting to someone who behaves like I Amsterdam a being eaten up by them. I enjoy to be devoured. If I am with a regula manner i sometimes make the mistake of feeling like he is using me and i dont like it at all, but by the time i decide that my imagination was mmm negative, my body is responding positively.
So sure of course i enjoy the fantasy of having hot socio sex. But i dont like the waking up to the truth part. - I need love to be good to myself. In the past i mistook love and sex as the same thing. I m trying to get to a place i can put them together as closely as i can. So i often use fantasy to acheive it.
I hope you dont mind that i flirt with you and imagine hot socio sex.
I live a few hours from you.
I kind of like nerds. I like strong nerds who intelluctualize everything and then they seem like completely different person in the sac. I like contradictions. I generally dont like model types.
DeleteI m very sensitive when t comes to odor. I can tell by a light brush on their face with my mouth whether we will be compatible sexually.I need a whiff.
They need to stimulate me mentally , make me thinks. I get bored easily. I need someone who can keep up with my this for stimulation I guess. And I really need a man who wants to have sex as much as I do.
I actually think we would potentially be a good match. I think I would satisfy at least a sufficient fraction of your desires and fantasies. Moreover, like all sociopaths, although I can be manipulative, I am actually very loyal to some people. It all depends on the relationship, but I'm not too much of a mooch. I was born into a very wealthy family, although they were EXTREMELY careful to never spoil us - we were given much less for birthdays and on holidays than other kids whose parents weren't even half as rich as ours. But, I'm very independent and I like to be self sufficient, even though I often do use my interactions with others to help achieve those aims. And I'm a brutally honest person. I won't lead you in to thinking things aren't how they are. I won't guarantee I will be 100% honest all the time with you, but probably more honest than most sociopaths or empaths. One thing most people who know me are truly amazed at how truthful I am, even if it leads to negative consequences. Lying can often lead to a big chain reaction that requires alot of time, energy, and more lying to keep the cover over peoples eyes. I would rather just be very vague or simply say "No comment" than lie pretty much all the time. There are exceptions but this is generally the rule. I'm also not saying that there wouldn't be any quirks that you and I would have to put up with, but everyone has their quirks. The foundation of any relationship is open and effective, honest communication
DeleteI was thinking how interesting it might be to meet somone from here. You sound so sweet...like too good to be true sweet, you know? And we all know what too good to be true is.
DeleteI was not spoiled either. I have good work ethic especially when it comes to working at relationships and communicating. Imo relationship is a rewarding job with enormous pay off so I also
prefer brutal honesty. But I am also paranoid, even with normal people. t could be exhaustion thing, dating a sociopath who was open about it. For the sociopath I mean, too. I would probable cry in the bathroom if uou ever said "no comment" to me lol.
I am extremely good at detecting inconsistencies in facial muscle responses .also body language. But like i said i am also paranoid. Youd probably have a blast tricking me. I dont think I would like it that way. Here we cannot see the physical clues . I rather like it this way.
Unfortunately I am possessive. I would imagine a sociopath would not like that but really idk.
To be honest, you're getting me really excited. And although you say your just flirting, you also mention you live a few hours from me. I'm sure turning the fantasy into a reality must have crossed your mind.... I wouldn't be surprised if reading that last sentence just started getting you horny :-P
DeleteI am a sweet guy, and I also tend to be very generous to those who I appreciate. I do have a scary side, but few people see that, and those are people who are predatory and simply had it comin. You have to realize that I have never been able to have anyone accept me for who I am and have a sexual relationship with me, the fact that you are turned on by the idea of it makes me especially interested in you.
I think at first we should just find a way to talk online or on the phone or something, and we can talk about some sexual fantasies.....and if you want to meet we can do it anywhere you are comfortable and I'd be happy to buy us dinner. You said pot makes you horny, so I'll bring a huge bag of pot to smoke and leave you with the leftovers so you can smoke and fantasize about me further once I'm gone :)
But believe me, if you can keep up with me, and especially if you can make me actually feel cared for I will be back for more. I won't just abandon you if you are fun to be with. In the world I am in, it's hard to trust most women, and many women who know of me are intimidated by me. What is so bad about being a dominant man? I don't want to hurt you and I might not even deem you fit to be a sexual partner, but if you are a good fit I figure - why not? I don't want to lead you into anything, although I would not lie about whether I would commit. If I would have to commit to have sex then we should simply spend time getting to know each other before doing that. I don't want to rush anything, but you seem cool and I would set aside some time to get to know you.
And answer this queston honestly....how old are you?
I just read that you missed your appt with machempath.
DeleteI saw that you were afraid she will abandon you. Do not be afraid of that. Be more afraid of abandoning your self.
I hope thatbu continue your discussions with her outside of this comment board, unless you do not care about people like me interrupting your flow with her.
It is more important to her that you do not abandon yourself than u not abandon your self.
Even if we meet and I committ to you, please don't try to manipulate me into not talking to her. I really think she might be a positive influence on me. I don't think she wants anything sexual from me.
DeleteWhat do you mean by abandoning myself? And can you give me your email address or something? I also have AIM (AOL Instant Messenger). I do have facebook but I only give it out to people I already am well acquainted with
And again, how old are you? I am 25.
DeleteI was wondering when you were going to ask about mystery age.
DeleteThe idea of having sex with someone so young does not turn me on so I like to envision you older. I am probably more than double your age. I am young at heart and you seem older than you say. Sorry I should have said sthg earlier. I did not know you were going to be this excited.
I am sorry that meeting in person is nokt an option. It isnt
that I fear you would find me unattractive bec i am older, although you might.I would be disappointed. I do not like young men for me. I could ask you to come disguised as a 45 year old ha.
But tbh if you were 45 I still wouldnt want to meet.
Yes sure I am turned on.....
There is nothing nicer than to have someone accept you for who you are. I spend a lot of time editing myself irl
Please do not offer me or other potential partners dinner and pot leftovers *rolls eyes* in order to secure company. You are enough. Besides you sound like youre on "To catch a predator".... the predator!
But maybe I sound just as predatorial. Sorry I flirted so well. I enjoy it. I enjoy talking to you but I understand if you want to cut contact now.
On the contrary! I like machempath for you. I am totally projecting when I say do not abandon yourself .
DeleteThose are my own issues. When I was your age I would mess up with people who wanted to mentor me...lookingback I see that I was not only not tak7ng advantage of their help, but that I was absndoning myself. I would have liked to have done better for myself. I was projecting and I dont mean to do that . I am sorry.
If the machempath is hearing me say this then I apologize to her
too. I am not suited for giving advice to others here.
I am not wanting to get involved with your relationship with her. I think she is lovely for you...
When I was younger I did sthg very courageous but I did not know that it was indicative of my character. Now I know why the incident stands out. I lost that part of me somewhere, or it never came to bloom. I think she doesnt want to see wasted potential. Neither do I like to see that.
Alright, then you can stop being flirty. I was not thinking it was taking you out to dinner that would get you to drop your pants, but I would want to get to know you in a casual setting before having sex with you. I didn't really take this too seriously, but I would have followed up if you were for real. I mean, I could go about it differently, but if I was going to consider any sort of relationship I just think that sort of thing makes sense. And based on your attitude, I wouldn't consider it worth the time and money to take you out for dinner anyway. And I'll have more pot, too (since I won't be giving you the "leftovers") so it's a win win at this point.
Deletei am sorry.
DeleteI was brought up taught that being flirty is a way to form relationship at first. It does get me into trouble. It is a bad combo especially with low self esteem and fear of abandonment. I have absense of thinking i have things other than my sexuality to offer.
I do not think people take me in seriously. . . . But if i do not give serious output then i guess it is my fault. I did not think you were wanting anything with me but sexual encounter. -Sociopaths are very clever at making a woman feel she is worth more than a casual fuck, so i just assumed you were lying about liking anything substantial about me. I assumed you were playing me just for a laugh.
Then I thought that you were treating me like a person who will fuck for pot or something. There are a lot of narcissists i know who have had gf who are drug addicts. They lured them with drugs and money, thinking that is the only way to their heart. I think i got a feeling you were going down that road with me, and mistaking me for someone who has more interest in money and drugs than human companionship. I think i got offended so then i got attitudey. sorry.
I did not mean to offend. Please do not take yourself away from me so fast. I just want to be friendly. I am lonely. Nobody in real life will want to be your friend if you wear your lack of confidence on your sleeve a lot. I have not learned how to handle myself. I am socially awkward inside myself.
Ha i must be the narcissist who think she must lure a man with sex to get to his heart . oh well. thank you for helping me see where i go wrong.
DeleteI wish you so much luck. If i was a younger girl and i didnt know anything about sociopaths and you did not tell me (and before i was so paranoid..) I would liked to have dated you probably. I would have chased you down. On paper you sound lovely, like an exception to a rule. I would have treated you with honesty and been very loving and loyal. I do wish that you find someone to be yourself with. I hope to be able to talk to you again. here. If I see you in another thread i will come out and say hello. My ex husband is Sicilian btw. Not that i am lumping all you mob types together. Just saying.
I am not as cuckoo as i seem. we are all cuckoos here anyway.
"I did not mean to offend. Please do not take yourself away from me so fast. I just want to be friendly. I am lonely. Nobody in real life will want to be your friend if you wear your lack of confidence on your sleeve a lot. I have not learned how to handle myself. I am socially awkward inside myself. "
DeleteTake myself away from you? We never even met, nor did you ever actually plan on meeting me. It seems like you simply want what you can't have, but then once you have the opportunity to get it, it becomes undesirable. I would rather have you chase me, want me, and not be able to have me than have myself do the same to you. So you can cry all you want about how your lonely and how I took myself away from you. Since ultimately, you never even brought yourself to me despite the fact that I extended such an invitation.
Although I do think their may be some manipulative sides to Mach, she in contrast is relatively direct and to the point (I'm not making a sexual reference here, I'm just talking about her communication as a whole). You on the other hand are very manipulative and not very honest. They say machavellian behavior consists of alot of lying, but she must be a really good one if that's the case since she seems to have an honesty about her.
*there, not their....lol
DeleteAlthough at least I use proper spelling, grammar and punctuation most of the time. To be honest, I was surprised to hear you were twice my age. Based on the way you write, I was honestly worried you were going to end up saying something between the ages of 14-18. So as far as the not taking you seriously thing, I can see why other people don't take you seriously. You should learn how to improve your communication skills, if you do that, I think I could take you more seriously. It's not that you don't have intelligent ideas....but there seems to be a major immaturity about you, and I honestly thought you were my age or maybe younger. I suppose maybe due to rising feminism, females from my generation may be more educated on average (since back in the day, the stay at home mom thing was more common, and now there are much more women in college). Not to say their potential for intelligence is higher, but I feel like in terms of book smarts, it makes more sense that current social changes would lead to women being more intelligen about certain things. Granted, they might not be as good at cooking you dinner and changing diapers, but they may know how to run a huge company, which you didn't see many women bragging about many years ago. I guess if you were at least 18 it would have been cool, but even at that point I wouldm't legally be able to take you out for a drink. And I'm much more careful about breaking laws with sexual partners than some of the other people I have hung around. So these were the things going through my head, and I guess you did fool me in a way - I really overestimated my intelligence when I assumed you seemed like you might just be some troubled teeny bopper. You literally sound like the girls I met in the Child Unit back at the first mental institution I was placed in for a week or two when I was 14 years old. I almost wonder if your just saying your old or something and are really some 12 year old behind a screen. But old dogs can learn new tricks. Buy a dictionary and a thesaurus and start to read and write more. Practice may not always make perfect, but it at least makes habit.
"Then I thought that you were treating me like a person who will fuck for pot or something. There are a lot of narcissists i know who have had gf who are drug addicts. They lured them with drugs and money, thinking that is the only way to their heart. I think i got a feeling you were going down that road with me, and mistaking me for someone who has more interest in money and drugs than human companionship. I think i got offended so then i got attitudey. sorry."
DeleteIt's not so much a prostitution thing. What it really relates to is my idea of gender roles. I grew up in a house where the father was very wealthy and paid for everything, but he had total control. My mother was not allowed to have a cel phone (neither were I or my siblings, until we reached high school) and he tapped our house phone to keep tabs on what we were doing and saying. My mom on the other hand had no control, but in exchange for taking care of me and my siblings so my dad didn't have to spend any time on us (except for "discipline" - since he was the official "disciplinarian" of the house - it seems to be the only interaction he actually looked forward to with us) she got to have all of her basic needs provided for. But in the end, my father really is a total penny pincher. That's one huge difference between me and him - he has tons of money and won't share a penny of it, whereas I would always share with my friends even if I didn't have a roof over my head that night. I'm definitely more generous than him in contrast... and even when he is generous with something there are ALOT of strings attached, even if he doesn't say it. I do sometimes attach strings to gifts/favors/rewards I give, but I generally make it clear what those strings are when I offer the gift, so they at least know what is expected of them if they choose to receive it. But overall i avoid being unnecessarily demanding of others.
Take myself away from you? We never even met, nor did you ever actually plan on meeting me. It seems like you simply want what you can't have, but then once you have the opportunity to get it, it becomes undesirable
DeleteNo, i did not want you to invite me out in person. I was hoping that you would not. I honestly just enjoy your conversation here. I like the idea of thinking about meeting. I could have sensed you would ask to meet and stopped you, but i neglected to, probably purposely, to avoid ending the sexual tension. I like the idea that you live near me. It is very nice for a fantasy.
You are definitely right about sthg else though. In my off line romantic life, with people who are unhealthy for me, it has been difficult getting to a place i would stop flirting and then declining invitations ...AFTER getting hurt. One of the reasons I am here is to examine behaviours and thoughts i have that cause me discomfort. I give mixed signals to a man like you this way.
Here, yes, your reasoning is correct.( I have been thinking that it is narcissism.) I have been thinkng that maybe i have come back to old partners who have hurt me in the past, made plans with them and then declined ( i could not go through with it) not only because i missed them very much, but because I want them to want me to see i am special, and they will change all for little old me. I want them to choose me over their selfish ways. It is a childish thing of mine unfulfilled. THat is one of the things i was referring to days ago....drives that compromise your moral whatever the fuck machempath talked about.
The drives left over from childhood wishes unfulfilled are traps. They are addictions keeping a person powerless over themselves. In real life these things waste my time, cause me anxiety, hurt me, cause me to repeat patterns, cause me masochistic pain, keep me in chains. I want to be free so bad, too.
Flirting with disaster (you, the devil, the fucking bain of my existence, someone who wants me but who i will mean utterly nothing to in the end) is very exciting to me and if we met, not only will i be stupid (you could kill me..you're a sociopath, right?) I would be ruining myself AND my fantasy. Thanks for helping that along so nice and quick :) Seriously, it has been therapeutic.
PS: Haven't you ever met someone in person and it ruined your image of them? Your imagination was better than the real thing?
I could say a bunch of stuff to you now that would be insulting to your character, dead wrong, first impression/second impression comparisons. If you are interested in hearing judgmental things because you want to better yourself or up your game and see how you come across socially, i will tell you how i see you. Let me know. Normally i won't do that kind of thing, but as i see you are quite enjoying to dissect my behaviour, and tell me about myself the way you see it, maybe you are inviting me to do the same? I will reciprocate. Would you like that?
"Flirting with disaster (you, the devil, the fucking bain of my existence, someone who wants me but who i will mean utterly nothing to in the end)"
DeleteFuck off. I'm not the devil. You should know since you seem to be a friend of his. Stop talking to me.
when i say "the devil" it is what you represent to me. I did NOT mean you personally. I dont know you well enough to call you a devil, nor do I believe in good or bad. i believe in productive responses to stimuli carefully thrown to destabilize. That is all you represent. I dehumanized you. Sorry.
DeleteTaking things personally over the internet after claiming you're a sociopath. Get over yourself.
You sound like an angel for the avenging angel, machempath :)
ReplyDeleteYeah, it's cool to have angels come down and help me and such. But what I was really hoping for was a booty call. Oh well, beggars can't always be choosers. LOL
DeleteSHe was even teasing you with promise of a red dress.
DeleteI'm no angel... just an earnest supporter of those that wrestle...
ReplyDeleteI love the story of Jacob's ladder bc he was strong enough to challenge God rather than knuckle under- Jacob was honorable enough not to resort to cheap tricks.
Yet, Jacob ultimately had God's blessing, despite much evidence to the contrary. I don't know what the hell it means, but I do suspect that Ndrangheta is someone whose spirit is like Jacob's. Strong willed, unyielding... and very much wrestling.
You are a blessing.
DeleteYes red....In CHURCH! Talk about titillating...
Deletethat comment should have been above.
DeleteYou are a blessing.
I read an article today in psychology today about the bad things that come along with our virtues. It was very interesting. I think you would like it Machempath, not that you are too virtuous, that isn't what i mean at all. How can you be too virtuous if you are machiavellian? I just think it would make you think..
prob everyone here would find it telling
http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/201308/when-virtue-becomes-vice
Deletethis is the article.
Also, i have to ask about this statement.
ReplyDelete"I am not titillated by flirting with "evil". "
What does this mean? Are you saying I am evil? Weren't you saying you wanted to look at me in a non-judgemental way? What do you think is so evil about me?
It's a nice way of saying she isn't into ya, Ndrag.
DeleteSome people think that if you are less sincere about attachments than they are that you are gong to be evil.
DeleteSome people take sex very seriously. It is the closest 2 people can get. If one person is feeling that and you are not, it is like being with evil. It is a dupe. That's why love "fraud"
thanks, anon, but I can handle this question. Your insight about sex being the closest 2 people can get is correct- but when I reference evil it has nothing to do with my fearing love fraud.
DeleteThat statement means:
This offer to meet is not about a potential romantic connection. And if it was, Ndrangheta, you should be very suspicious of my motivations. Sex is a powerful way to gain control over a person. Sure, casual hookups most often result in no attachment, just a cheapening of your ability to attach, but sex can be used to enslave another person on a very deep level. I don't understand the mechanics of this, but I see it play out in in the dynamic of domestic violence, and also as the explanation of the utter devastation a pedophile leaves in the train behind them.
If I thought that you, Ndrangheta, were evil, then I would stay far away from you. But something in me says that you are not and on a gut level I have the same sense that you are being prepared for something big. Your choices at this juncture matter enormously.
The first reason I am offering to meet with you is that it sounds like there is no one in your life who wants to serve as someone who will help you think through your options. Your father sounds like he has given himself over to evil. The so called therapist enables your fathers evil. I don't think that I have any answers and I certainly do not think that I am going to give you any answers to the questions you seek. The answers are already inside you. What I can do is provide you with a sounding board. I have no desire to harness your potential to service my goals, as these other people in your life do, and I suspect it would be a welcome relief to not fear that.
The second reason is a bit more mystical, and if it sounds unappealing to you I think you should choose to write me off as a nut, and do not bother trying to find your way to Hingham (it's about an hour from Providence). The reason is- Christ said, "When two or more are gathered in my name, I am there in their midst." You are seeking direction, and to have the presence of Christ available to enter into your decision making process mighty provide you with answers you have been unable to untangle on your own.
In offering to meet with you, I am not trying to signal that I am your ticket to God (that would be incredibly arrogant and also untrue). Any sincere follower of Christ could serve the same purpose. But be careful, because some of the most evil people hide behind and within the church. The best test I can give you to tell who is truly seeking Christ vs who is using Christ's words as a disguise for something more sinister is to rely on the same sixth sense you use to be still internally to understand an opponent.
I definitely don't think you are evil. And I do believe you are being prepared for powerful work ahead. It would be an honor to wish you well in person.
Well, sex is a purely sensational thing for me, it's not an emotional thing. I do get attached to certain sexual activities, although I don't get too attached to people. Sometimes I do temporarily, but I have never been in a committed/long term sexual relationship before and it's likely that I may die before ever entering one. Yes, I have sex, but not often and with random people. It is exciting but as stated earlier anyone who has actually had sex to me does not want to get to close to me, and based on the crazy things I say and do while having sex, that makes alot of sense. Even though I come from a wealthy family, no gold digger has been crazy enough yet to try and manipulate me. Not saying it couldn't happen but it would be a dangerous pursuit with many traps set along the way just in case.
Delete"on a gut level I have the same sense that you are being prepared for something big. Your choices at this juncture matter enormously. "
I agree. This something big you refer to is discussed in The Book of Revelation. I often go back and forth about this issue. Most of the time I'm really here to help people. But when I have alot of negative social experiences in a short period of time I start developing this mentality of FUCK HUMANKIND DESTROY THEM ALL. Then when things start going more smoothly I go back to my more natural mentality.
"But be careful, because some of the most evil people hide behind and within the church"
I'm aware....this is why I don't go to church. The church originally meant all of Christ's followers, not a specific place. In early Christian days, Christians were persecuted, so they could not really worship as publicly as they would like, and it was a more underground thing. However, as you said, you don't need to be in any special place, the only requirement for his presence is for 2 or more to be gathered in his name. This is the correct practice, instead of a massive group gathering to be indoctrinated in a pagan-based religious service (modern church services are based mainly off Pagan rituals, not Christian ones) in a passive way. I feel like old school Christianity must have been alot more conversational rather than indoctrinational.
" who is using Christ's words as a disguise for something more sinister"
At best, that would be an unconscious motive. If I wanted to go that route, I would probably just start my own cult.
Is Hingham near Cambridge? It says it's in the greater Boston area, and I know Cambridge is by Watertown and Belmont but I don't know what else. I used to have an administrative position at a very large cemetery in Cambridge, so I know the area around there a little bit. I have a GPS regardless.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteI won't embarrass you in front of your children, don't worry. The only way I would ever consider anything that would violate you is if you violate me. I was planning on having a sex n cocaine session tonight, but if I do that I will probably be awake until 5 am and won't show up for church. I will cancel my sex n drugs n rock n roll plans and I'll come sit with you tomorrow in the last pew on the left. I will be in a black suit with a red collared shirt under it. Black shoes and black Gucci shades (G's on the sides).
ReplyDeleteI appreciate that you are interested in being a mentor of sorts to me. Others have reached out to me in this way, and some actually have helped me to some extent. As far as the therapist, I don't see him anymore, I only saw him while I was locked up at the institution, until I was released, which was pretty much as soon as I said I would keep my family's secrets instead of extorting them and threatening to expose them if they don't pay me.
"I believe that it's very important to understand your situation on a Machiavellian level to anticipate your opponents next move (you are a martial arts student so I know you understand this) as a form of self defense."
You should read Sun Tzu's Art of War. It's considered to be the best book ever written on military/combat strategy and is now most commonly bought by businessmen, since his conflict strategies work just as well in the world of business and politics as they do in the military. My martial arts style is mainly based upon developing the sensitivity of my body, particularly in my arms. The sensitivity is so refined at this point that if my arm is in contact with any part of your body, I know at all times where your next move is based on feeling. As soon as I feel where you are going to go and what you are going to do, I move in a way that you are put into a compromised position and are easily countered while I end up in a dominant position, where it's more difficult to hit me than it is for me to hit you. That's at least a major aspect of the main idea.
Just curious, why do you think I'm being prepared for something big? I'm not saying I disagree (I don't), I just want to understand your logic regarding the situation and see how it relates to mine.
By the way, don't worry about the father being a marine comment. I will find you, and you will find me. Seek and you shall find, knock and the door shall be opened.
ReplyDeleteSee you tomorrow :D
A request. I guard my reputation carefully as a member of my community. I am well known and to be associating with a young man who dresses conspicuously differently from the rest of the congregation will cause lots of gossip. (This town is very wealthy, white, and preppy).
ReplyDeleteMy good name is important to me because I am the head of a household with four children. If I am perceived as being the sort of woman who has dalliances with younger men of "questionable character" (meaning you look like an outsider, then that will haunt my family. In my experience, people's perceptions of your character is everything in terms of what doors open and close for you. Please don't be offended by this. It's just the reality I must deal with. I refuse all dating invitations from local men for this reason, because I do not want to be perceived as a loose woman. (I don't judge people on appearances, but I have learned that to ignore that some people do and will penalize you has caused me to be careful.)
So come sit in the same pew, and I will pass you a note when we pass the peace (a part in the service where everyone shakes hands) and it will tell you how to get to the place we can go to talk. I do hope that you will come.
I understand your guidelines, they make sense and I can keep quiet.
DeleteKeep in mind that although you will be observing me and making judgements based on such observations, I will be doing the same thing with you. The place you ask me to go to in order to talk should be a place that I don't find to seem suspicious. A place that is relatively public and safe, as well as discreet (no eavesdroppers) will do. I have been in life threatening situations before and I'm well prepared to handle them - but I know I'm far from invincible which is the nature of my paranoia. For some reason, however, you do seem to have a sincerity about you. Nonetheless, I will be watching, and whether or not I decide to go to the place to meet will depend on whether you are able to find a suitable location.
It will be open air, public dining.
DeleteAlso, I notice you told me not to dress suspiciously, but aren't people supposed to dress nice for church? I used to go as a child, many men wore suits. I grew up in a white, preppy town. Granted, I spent alot of time in the city and on many days I wear a black leather trench coat that almost touches my feet, but I was not planning on rocking such attire for this occasion. I felt a suit would be more fitting. No tie, just a suit. I will be wearing sunglasses but will remove them when I enter the church.
DeleteThe red shirt will be conspicuous. I'd go with something more neutral. If you are under 30, a suit jacket is optional- dress pants are more typical. Please don't come to church after a cocaine bender because while you may think you can pull it off, it will bring a sort of energy that will call negative attention to you.
DeleteThat being said, wear what you want. I don't want to be overly controlling. I am simply suggesting guidelines for blending in.
I already told you I'm cancelling my plans for tonight so I can be ready for tomorrow. I don't often cancel plans on a whim for people, but I feel that our meeting is more important/ I don't really know exactly why it's more important yet, and maybe after we meet I'll feel like it was a waste of my time, but I'm confident enough that it won't be to drive an hour to your church.
DeleteI could wear white, but it would be too cliche. I don't have a ton of clothes, sociopaths tend to dress very generically. Even when I've had a larger wardrobe I still usually only wore combinations of a few different things, many things I never wore and I wore the same things much of the time. As I have gotten older I have an outfit or two or three for each situation, but I'm definitely generic. They go through the laundry every day though, so they are always still clean. I won't talk with you at the church, I'll just be sitting next to you. Once people get to know me, they often find an intimidating side of me but to most outsiders I actually appear to be of high character. I wouldn't say that my character is completely low anyway, in many ways I think my character isn't so bad, but I still have room to grow like anybody else. Regardless, I don't usually come off as too sketchy unless I really want to. I have a baby face and people open up to me easily (at least in the beginning).
suit pants, white shirt are a safe bet. no need to over think.
DeleteHonestly Mach, do you really think manipulating a man as stubborn as me into wearing what you want him to is going to be that easy?
DeleteI'm not trying to be offensive, if I was able to verbalize the above sentence it would be in a playful way. And I know your just trying to give advice. But I can be a stubborn bastard. I do often take advice from other people, particularly when I ask for it, although if I'm given advice when I don't ask for it I often get very defensive. I apologize if this aspect of me frustrates you but it's just how I am. At least I'm honest....I won't be setting you up for any crazy surprises and I hope the same is true of you.
And if your wearing red, I feel like I should have the right to as well. I'll at least be tolerant enough of social norms to not actually wear a red dress though :-P I think the red collared shirt is a better option than a red dress. for me, at least. It will mostly be covered by my suit jacket anyway, which is more neutral. And in regards to over thinking, I think it is you who is really over thinking the situation :-P
I will do just fine, don't you worry. I really am hoping this isn't all just too good to be true. I really hope you are who you say you are.
I don't really care what you wear. You're not my boy toy. Since we'll be meeting for real at the second location, you might find my demeanor to be initially standoffish. But it's only for the reason that it is crucial for me not to appear to be a woman in her late thirties having a midlife crisis and I know that you have different reasons for valuing your privacy, so my actions reflect my perception of our shared self interest.
DeleteI can assure you that I do not have nefarious motives. In fact, I'm a little unclear WHY I am meeting you, beyond a gut instinct that it would be a good thing. On paper, it makes no sense. The people I have run this by think I am crazy. I agree with their concerns because you are an unknown entity (so to speak). I guess the only way for me to explain my willingness to go out on a limb is an emotional response to your dilemmas that is some combination of curiosity, tenderness- and (dare I say it...) recognition. Perhaps the entire experience will be anti-climatic for you (emotionally as well as physically) and it will leave you wondering "why the hell did I do that?" I can't answer that. You have your own reasons for coming to church with a woman you've never met who is not a likely romantic target.
I don't know you beyond our brief exchange here so I make no promises other than this one: I will never lie to you. And if I do not give you whatever you might think you want out of this exchange, it will be from a place of goodwill/personal limitations, not malevolent withholding.
So... until then...
"It will be open air, public dining."
ReplyDeletePerfect. If we can order a few things that we can split, instead of each having our own thing, that would be ideal. If we continue to meet (even if its only every few months or so) then I probably won't make this request for future encounters. However, unless I was able to choose the location of where we eat, I will only eat food that you also eat.
I look forward to meeting you Mach. You seem like a nice woman and I really am confused about exactly where this is going to lead, and also exactly what all your motivations and intentions are. As stated earlier, there is something about the way that you communicate that I like, and you definitely seem like a person who deserves to be taken seriously. Thank you for extending the invitation to meet.
I have no agenda. I offered to meet after I had said a prayer for you (after an early exchange) and the idea kept popping into my head. To be honest, I am more than a little uncomfortable with the idea because I am cognizant of the risks. From an outsider's perspective it looks like madness (my sister knows because she is my best friend- she still lives in Georgia).
DeleteSo why meet? Because this exchange has revealed to me your humanity. You are suffering and you are living in a dangerous world. I can not solve any of your problems, but I want to affirm the part of you that considers seeking the way out of the labyrinth you were born into. Perhaps my sympathies are aroused because I had to escape my own labyrinth a number of years ago. It is no accident that I am a very strategic thinker. I am lucky that I did not have an "accident" that would have ended me. Along my way, I've had unexpected helpers who I owe my life and my children's well being to. My way of saying thank you to those helpers is to be willing to be a helper myself, even if it feels frightening on some level.
To be honest, I feel like it's a little nutty for me to meet you. After all, you're on some sociopath website, how do I know you're not ten times as nuts as me?
DeleteThat being said, there is something very comforting about you. I just still am amazed by the fact that you really want to go so far out of your way to help someone that many people would rather not even talk to. Granted, I know alot of people and see alot of people around but only a small fraction of my relationships have any level of real intimacy and even then I just am not emotionally developed. So it doesn't really go where they can get things to go with other people. When I was a child I was definitely very violent, but as I've gotten older I have matured and calmed down a bit, and I really don't go out of my way to hurt people. Even though I do have higher goals and objectives, the main thing is just ensuring my own survival and if someone steps on my toes I figure out a way to handle it, but I really just want to leave other people alone and have them leave me alone when it comes to alot of things. I guess that's the "Anti Social" side of ASPD - I do enjoy doing things socially in some regards although overall I tend to be somewhat anti social. And alot of things that many people do socially I only do by myself.
let me know once you've read this so we can both delete all comments.
ReplyDeleteI don't think I can delete my comments since I simply posted it under an anonymous name and sometimes I added a website link to a wikipedia article on the Ndrangheta. But, since I did not make my postings under any sort of account, I don't think I can delete them. Without there being an account for it, there is no one with privilege to delete the posts besides the blog moderator. Your posts are different because you are posting under an account. However, I use things like proxies and encryption and I avoid using accounts that are linked to any of my personal information when doing things on the internet. I apologize if this dynamic creates frustration for you, but I am not out to expose you.
ReplyDeleteno worries- I have nothing to hide. It's more about my hesitation to leave a conversation transcribed in cyberspace indefinitely- and given the things you've hinted at I really don't want to piss off anyone in your circles.
DeleteIn most areas of my life (Facebook, what I do for a living) I am very open. The reason is that a good check for me on my behavior is: do I feel the need to conceal my actions? If so, why? Generally it helps me spot flaws in my moral reasoning if I feel that secrecy is an important part of something I am involved in. I have zero tolerance for lying, but am aware that the human condition means that I must wrestle with my own need to tell half truths, based on the audience. For example- with my kids. There is some information about their father I will not share because even though he has his flaws he is a loving father. I do not want to do anything to make them think less of him, even if that means avoiding giving direct answers to pointed questions.
My reason for suggesting deleting the comments has less to do with me, and more to do with you. It's my choice to live my life in the open (with the caveat that I am careful to avoid generating reasons to be gossiped about) but given your life, I understand why you can't. I suspect that there are people in your world that would be very upset with what you've written and that you might be endangered if these words came back to haunt you.
A final point: when we meet and talk, you may tell me things. I feel strongly about keeping confidences, but if you were to tell me that you intend to cause bodily harm to a specific person that I might feel I could prevent, then your need to not have your confidence violated would be in direct conflict with my conscience. Let's not go there. Be aware that preserving human life and human dignity is a top value of mine, and I would feel that compulsion stronger than any attachment that comes from having a conversation, even if I am sympathetic to you. In other words: I want no knowledge of any specific criminal activities that I might one day be called to speak about if subpoenaed. That is for both of our protection, and for the protection of my children.
I am comfortable leaving this conversation up if you can not delete your side. There is nothing I am ashamed of having said. If you have concerns in the days ahead, you can contact M.E. Thomas directly and request that the conversation be taken down. But I will leave that up to you.
One other thing - if red is such a bad color to wear, why are you planning on wearing a red dress?
ReplyDeleteI was deliberately picking something that it would be unlikely that another woman would be wearing. Plus, women wear bright colors in preppy culture. With the exception of godawful golf pants, men stick to neutrals, pastels, and navy. Black and red on a man with gucci sunglasses would make people very aware you were an outsider.
DeleteWell, if that was my best guess then I think I'll look like an outsider regardless. On the other hand, I do have strong charm and charisma, I will look like an outsider, but an interesting and appealing outsider. Looking a little out of the ordinary can be to your benefit if you do it right and get the kind of attention you want, rather than the attention you dont want. This has often served to my benefit in the past. I know that I'm not normal, and even though I can imitate and mimic other peoples actions and speech well, I still don't come out looking exactly the same much of the time. Ultimately, this is something I simply must accept and embrace and find ways to use it to my advantage in ways that don't upset other people too much.
DeleteI also think it makes perfect sense you would not want to piss off me and some of the people in my circles, although without stepping on anyone's toes you would be fine. And although you are correct in that if my family found out some of the things I said on here, they would be upset, but it would be more of a stern talking to than anything else. The only person I would really potentially be worried about is my father, but he knows I have said much more about him to some of my close friends and past therapists. Moreover, my family is low key, and although we definitely stand out to those who do know us, we are not too flashy or notorious. People who grew up with us and know us have some idea of who we are, but they know that overall we just like to keep to ourselves for the most part and not stir up drama and cause attention. Although it would be possible for you to gain enough information to potentially figure out my last name and contact my family members if you use certain surveillance/espionage techniques, although actually contacting them would be a very risky endeavor, particularly if you were considered a threat. Even if you did not threaten them, they don't like outsiders knowing too much. However, it would probably bring more attention if they were to do something about you than if they simply ignored you, since the amount of dirt you have is very minimal compared to others who have tried to do things with the legal system in the past - most attempts have been unsuccessful up to this point, and many of those attempts involved individuals with knowledge much deeper and intricate than yours about certain things....so even though if you tried to do something stupid, it would frustrate me, the problem would be solved one way or another. And you really don't seem like you're a stupid person. Unless you really wanted to live a life in fear and in hiding, pissing off certain people can be a very bad idea - I know from experience, I have had to go off the grid for a few months one time and live with complete strangers in Maine until an issue smoothed over a few years back. And I've noticed that although my family can be rather ruthless, they are much more forgiving to family members than outsiders.
As far as me posting mostly vague things, besides things that are already known to law enforcement about my family, they wouldn't consider it worth it to kill me or whatever. I've been in much more tense situations with them, and although the consequences have often been very abusive and severe, there would need to be alot of decisions by many people to be able to have permission to take me out. A family member once tried to put a hit out on me in the past and was denied permission despite the fact that he is more useful to them financially (at least, for the short term, probably not as much in the long). Moreover, the family as a whole was pretty pissed off at me at that time, and there still was no permission granted. I'm not completely untouchable, nobody is, even a boss, but I'm not overly worried about the issue or I would not have made my postings. Even though my postings may seem very detailed, they really only scratch the surface, and the only people who have the resources to do anything about it already know at least most of the things I have said.
DeleteI look forward to meeting you tomorrow. Take care and be safe. :)
see you there!
ReplyDeleteMach, I really do apologize for not being able to make it. I'm very upset about the whole thing, especially because now I feel like you might be suspicious of me since I did not come and might totally abandon me. Especially since what happened was totally outside of my control, some of my hopes will be crushed if you alienate from me because I couldn't make it today. So here's what happened:
DeleteI did not go on a drug bender last night as planned. If I did, I would still be sleeping right now most likely. I was deeply excited to meet with you and I woke up on time and I got ready and everything. While passing through providence on 95, I started hearing a clicky noise down by my tire. So I took the next exit and pulled over. I looked at all my tires, I felt them and they all seemed fine. I didn't take it to a gas station to check the pressure but they seemed okay, I thought it was just a leaf stuck somewhere or something. So I get back on the highway, and shortly after crossing the mass state line, POP - my wheel totally blows out. Fortunately, I was only a quarter mile from an exit and a shell was right next to the exit, and I was able to get there before my rim started getting fucked up. I put on a spare, and would have been able to get there at least by 10:15-10:30 at that point (after having to get off the highway twice, and then change a tire, I was set back a bit - I planned to be there a half hour early and my GPS said I would be there at 9:30). However, I have driven on this spare before, and boston and back is a long drive. I used to do it almost everyday last year when I worked as a system administrator, and a few times a week for 5 years before that to go to Chinatown. Especially after just having my tire go flat, I was really nervous about going all the way up there and back on a spare tire, since you aren't supposed to drive far on them. To make matters worse, mass drivers usually go 70-80 mph on the highway (RI drivers its 60-70) and you aren't supposed to drive over 50 mph on a spare.
You have no idea how frustrated i am. I really wanted to start punching the metal donation box by the gas station as hard as I could (after I was able to withstand punching and kicking trees well, I moved to metal street lights for conditioning, so I can handle it). I was so upset, I feel like I have failed you. And I really was looking forward to meeting you, so I feel like I failed myself too. I hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me, I really want to give this another go as soon as possible. I know you said your often with your kids so I know it may not be as soon as i would like but that's fine, I don't want to rush you or make you feel uncomfortable. However, I do have a sense of urgency about the issue since you seem to be offering a form of help that I am deeply in need of, and you are correct that many decisions I make at this point of my life may not just effect myself but all of our actions generally affect others,. I hate admitting when I have any feelings of attachment to something, but the things you have said really make me feel like I do genuinely need your help. I hope you are not angry at me and hope we can figure something out.
By the way, I went to a couple body shops today but they were both closed, and I only like going places I trust. They will be open tomorrow so I will have the tire fixed tomorrow and my schedule is relatively open. I do need some degree of notice since I usually make plans a day ahead of time but in a way I'm sort of my own boss and choose my own hours. Please get back to me Mach, and please try to be understanding. If I simply did not want to come I would say so, please don't misinterpret what happened.
As far as why the tire blew out, there is a small nail/screw sized hole on the treads of the tire that popped. So it was a freak accident. This sort of thing is very rare, although it is not the first time I've had a flat tire. It's just really frustrating it had to happen TODAY. I have not been looking forward to meeting someone as much as this in quite a while. I really felt like I was doing something I should do and it frustrates me how often times when I try to do the right thing it just collapses on me. I can't stop thinking about how pissed off I am that this didn't happen, and I'm especially pissed because I was the one who fucked it up. It gives me a feeling of incapability, even though I know I was capable it was just a freak accident. But you really have no idea how upset I am. I understand if your upset too, I just hope your not upset with ME, because I really had no intention on failing to be there on time and doing things according to plan. Please forgive me.
ReplyDeletePlease respond as soon as you get these messages Mach. I want to at least know how you feel about the situation. My mind is going in circles right now and a big part of me wishes I just bit the bullet and took the risk driving on a spare. But the triple A guy told me I really shouldn't drive too far on it especially since this isn't the first time I used the spare. Please please please please don't hold this against me. I will do my best to make it up to you. Please stay in touch and let me know how we can sort this out.... my mind is going to keep going in crazy loops until I at least have some sense of where your at mentally at this point.
ReplyDeleteI feel like you have offered me an opportunity that if I pass up I may not be able to receive again anytime soon, if ever. It really does mean alot to me. And even though I don't even totally know what I'm in for and exactly what you have in store for me, I have an inner sense that is telling me I NEED to accept your help. Please get back to me Mach.
You were missed...
ReplyDeleteI do believe that things have a way of unfolding as they should, and on the correct timeline. After participating in too many fortunate coincidences, I do not worry if things do not work out as originally anticipated and am not one to sulk or over interpret an absence.
Sometimes life intrudes... what matters is the inclination of your spirit. I kept you in my prayers before and during the service, and I will continue to do so. I was struck by the gospel reading today, in light of your circumstances. It was a very pointed call to follow Christ and leave even your family behind. Coincidence? Perhaps. If you want you can always google the scripture of the day if you type in Episcopal Church and the days date. Today's gospel was Luke 14:25-33. It's pretty cryptic, yet perhaps it will speak to you.
I will be solo again in 2 weeks- should I wear blue? ;) You are always welcome.
PS- pay attention to your inner sense- please be comforted in knowing that I am more of a signpost to the answer/path you need, rather than the sole possessor of that answer. I think that this interaction is really between you and God. I am simply the voice saying, "Pay attention to whatever is going on internally, Ndrangheta. It matters." If we never meet, but you listen to that inner voice, then maybe that was the point of all of this.
DeleteThat being said, the researcher in me did a little bit of investigative digging and while I have no clue who you or your family are, I do know that Rhode Island is the hub of New England Human Trafficking. This is an issue very near to my heart, and I've worked hard to help get state legislation through in MA to help address this growing problem. I'll avoid my soapbox, but the thought occurred to me that your unique situation and your self identification as an "avenging angel" might somehow be connected. The amount of good you could do for a shocking number of women and children sex slaves is way more than an outsider like me could accomplish. Just a thought...
I do believe you are chosen to fulfill an important purpose but have no idea if the above is connected. You will know when you connect with the right purpose by the ridiculous number of coincidences. You will receive help from unexpected places.
If we meet someday we can talk further- but for now, just know that you are Beloved. And that you were created in God's image.
Thank you Mach. I will be there in two weeks time. Although i am indeed a stubborn bastard, I do feel like I failed us both and must make it up to you. Therefore, despite my stubbornness not only can you dress in blue (or whatever color you like) but you can also dictate which color shirt I wear. The suit and shades and shoes will stay the same though. The only thing I change with that outfit is the shirt - ever.
ReplyDeleteAs far as are those two things connected, there are no direct plans regarding that industry at this point in time. Although indoor prostitution used to be outright legal in RI and even still they pay off alot of people to keep it going (especially the massage parlors). I won't go into too much detail about these places, although the women who work at the parlors tend to be asian and speak very little English. As stated earlier, I have no direct plans regarding them at this point in time, but because of some of my experiences I think it's a pretty fucked up way of doing things. I think prostitution should be legal (since if it's illegal, it continues to thrive, perhaps even moreso in some circumstances, and the illegality just causes more problems) but it should be ONE HUNDRED PERCENT CONSENTUAL. Without the Department of Labor enforcing strict standards, the show will go on as it has. But they are only one link in the chain, there is so many worse things that some people in this world (many whom I do not know, but I know of certain hidden agendas) are trying to accomplish.... my goals stretch far far beyond New England. The local issues I feel have definitely helped form my perspective and attitude and motivations, although many of these motivations and attitudes take the microcosm and translate it into actions that affect the macrocosm, if that makes any sense.
I will read the scripture soon and will get back to you on some of my thoughts. Thank you for getting back to me so soon, and thank you for having me in your thoughts. Although I don't try to be overly intrusive (I respect people's privacy, and don't try to bother them if they don't want to see me, unless there is a serious problem I have with them) i really am the type of person that is in it for the "long haul" with most relationships I create. Granted, my sexual relationships have never worked that way, but I think I will get that figured out eventually. Many of my other relationships have actually been mutually beneficial for long periods of time, so even though I might not see you often, I would like to at least keep in touch if things go well with you. I'm already very intrigued by you, and if anything, after knowing me for a short period of time you will probably be more protected than endangered from creating a bond with me. Thank you again, take care Mach. You seem awesome.
Another thing.... I live in Rhode Island, and Rhode Island probably has a higher concentration of mafia activity than any other state in the country overall (some parts of New York City and New Jersey and what not may be heavily mafia controlled, but as far as the state as a whole the Italians have a strong hand in the whole thing). However, the New England Mafia (the Rhode Island branch of which is the Patriarca family, which hasn't been actively ran by actual Patriarca's for a while) is still ultimately a relatively local operation. The Patriarca family was much more local, and had an iron fist over RI back in the 60's and 70's, but they are less visible and more hidden, and their control as well as activities has shifted in different ways. Regardless though, they are very small fish compared to the 'Ndrangheta, which is not only an international group, but the most powerful, dangerous, well connected, shadowy/hidden, and it also generates more money than any other Italian based group (this information is based solely on in the media and law enforcement statistics, I'm not saying my personal experience can verify this) in the entire world.
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ReplyDelete*wear* not where- damn autocorrect!
ReplyDelete"Luke 14:25-33
ReplyDeleteNew International Version (NIV)
The Cost of Being a Disciple
25 Large crowds were traveling with Jesus, and turning to them he said: 26 “If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even their own life—such a person cannot be my disciple. 27 And whoever does not carry their cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.
28 “Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Won’t you first sit down and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it? 29 For if you lay the foundation and are not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule you, 30 saying, ‘This person began to build and wasn’t able to finish.’
31 “Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Won’t he first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32 If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace. 33 In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples."
Wow.....fucking creepy. Are you sure you didn't look around in the Bible for a fitting scripture? This happens to me all the time. When I read the Bible I usually open to a random page, and it usually has creepy significances towards certain things, sometimes really creepy and detailed.
As far as everything happening for the reason, who knows, maybe it was divine intervention. Or perhaps it could even be a negative entity (although such an act of hoped-for intimidation I would interpret as ultimately a sign of weakness and fear in the opponent regarding the circumstances). Or perhaps I just ran over a nail. After all, I didn't hear the clicky noise til I was passing through Providence, and I drove around in my neighborhood to get a coffee and egg sandwich before the trip, I didn't hear the clicky noise, and the hole looks like it was made from running over a nail or screw.
"I spent last night doing some research and can confirm that everything you've written appears in secondary sources."
ReplyDeleteCorrect. I was going to send you some links. I often appear to be stupid and saying too much in some circumstances, but even when I take risks they are extremelI spent last night doing some research and can confirm that everything you've written appears in secondary sources.y calculated in a meticulous way. So, although my communication appears to be loud, I have come to find that I am often able to preserve my secrets even better when people think I've already told them everything there is to know. Some of my asian friends are simply quiet, but alot of Italians are very loud in some ways, although there are definitely certain rules, particularly regarding legal issues. Being loud is very effective in getting more people to hear you, but when more people hear you, you must be more careful. This is why everything I say you can already find somewhere else, so for the record, everything I say I simply heard somewhere else. As the saying in the old 'Ndrangheta song "Omerta" goes: "I am dumb, deaf, blind, and even mute" this is an english translation of a lyric written in the dialect of the 'Ndrangheta, which is a mixture of Italian, Greek and Spanish.
But yeah - so don't worry too much about other people worrying about things I have said here. It's all just copy and pasted. After all, when I was in that psyche ward, I was diagnosed as being a paranoid and delusional schizophrenic, despite the fact that I lacked hallucinations. And although me and all my friends disagree with the diagnosis (as well as pretty much all my family members, including my father), I have technically been diagnosed with that disorder and it's perfectly plausible that I have no ties to anything shady, it could all be some figment of my imagination. I suppose you would have to spend time with me day to day to really know. Nudge nudge, wink wink ;)
Wtf? That post just got screwed up. Let me redo it:
ReplyDeleteCorrect. I was going to send you some links. I often appear to be stupid and saying too much in some circumstances, but even when I take risks they are extremely calculated in a meticulous way. So, although my communication appears to be loud, I have come to find that I am often able to preserve my secrets even better when people think I've already told them everything there is to know. Some of my asian friends are simply quiet, but alot of Italians are very loud in some ways, although there are definitely certain rules, particularly regarding legal issues. Being loud is very effective in getting more people to hear you, but when more people hear you, you must be more careful. This is why everything I say you can already find somewhere else, so for the record, everything I say I simply heard somewhere else. As the saying in the old 'Ndrangheta song "Omerta" goes: "I am dumb, deaf, blind, and even mute" this is an english translation of a lyric written in the dialect of the 'Ndrangheta, which is a mixture of Italian, Greek and Spanish.
But yeah - so don't worry too much about other people worrying about things I have said here. It's all just copy and pasted. After all, when I was in that psyche ward, I was diagnosed as being a paranoid and delusional schizophrenic, despite the fact that I lacked hallucinations. And although me and all my friends disagree with the diagnosis (as well as pretty much all my family members, including my father), I have technically been diagnosed with that disorder and it's perfectly plausible that I have no ties to anything shady, it could all be some figment of my imagination. I suppose you would have to spend time with me day to day to really know. Nudge nudge, wink wink ;)
"I do feel that Amsterdam has the right idea in decriminalizing prostitution because it creates less of a dynamic for exploitation by third parties like pimps who get their girls mostly under sketchy circumstances- plus there's the whole underage thing"
ReplyDeleteI agree. To some extent things need to be regulated, but by outright forbidding them there isn;t really any control over it at all. I think it should be controlled, but by simply ignoring it, or punishing people who are trapped in it and feel they can't escape anyway, isn't really going to help solve the problem. This is why I also believe in liberty. I don't really refer to myself as libertarian, I don't associate with any specific mainstream party, and I'm certainly not an anarchist (an anarchic state of society can be useful temporarily for the purpose of creating a new one, but an anarchy is simply unlikely to ever really last very long as social groups form after the destruction of the old order, so you would want to have some influence over where things go after the temporary period of chaos).
I will figure out a way for us to contact each other online in a way that is less viewable by the public. To be honest, I would be totally willing to talk to you on the phone too, although I sense you would find this to be too flirty and/or invasive or something. But it's cool, I have my quirks, and you have yours. :)
I really do feel like I'm so crazy for really pursuing this, and I know you do too. I guess we really are a little crazy. But I feel like we both have something there that is truly special. If you know what I mean then you know what I mean.
The way I see it is this:
ReplyDeleteEvery now and then I get a sense that says "pay attention". That happened for me a few days back when I got the sense I should invite you to church. It's a not a messiah complex, because I am well aware that our life experiences are very different, and I can't just surgically graft a religious experience I find to be comforting on you and expect it to have the same effect.
It's more like this: I think everybody comes to a certain number of crossroads in their life that tends to set the direction for where they are going. Sometimes a decade can go by between them, sometimes they come quicker. But they generally correspond to major life choices and the ripple effect of each choice irrevocably changes the pattern of your life. Example: Choosing to get married at the age of 20 was a crossroads decision for me. As a result of that early marriage, I had four children in six years and they are both the best thing that ever happened to me and very much a limiting factor on my free spirit personality.
From the ambivalence you express when writing about your family business, I sense you are at a place where you break free or go ahead and drink the kool aid. To be writing about such an intensely personal decision like this suggests to me that you are seeking clarity.
I know that I can't give you any answers, so as far as the "this" between us, I want to be really careful not to over insert my own bias into your decision making process. So why bring up Jesus? Well, even though I was religious my whole life, I didn't ever really get a sense of divine presence, but that has changed as I've had to face some dangerous stuff. What you describe is no picnic. My sense is that you need protection on some level that is not entire here in the physical realm. That is why I am praying for you- specifically that you will come to a place of stillness inside so that you can tune into what you already know, deep down.
Sometimes working from within an organization is most effective. In other cases, you must flee a culture that infects you on a soul level. Because I have no first hand knowledge of what you are up against I can only pray that you are "delivered from evil".
My role in your life is not something either of us needs to over think. For now- I want to confirm that you are not crazy. You think and write well. I've heard it said that to be well adjusted in a sick situation is a sign of mental illness. Your distress fits with an overall pattern of sanity, IMO, given what you have described. My reaching out is about me wanting you to understand that I give a shit. Nobody should have to face what you are describing alone. At the same time, I have no illusions that I can fix anything for you. You are at a crossroads and you are going to need to find the inner strength to choose your path.
I'm not against talking to you on the phone, but I won't publish it to this wall. If you have a P.O. box or other secure mailing address, I actually had something I planned to give you today, and if I pop it in the mail I can include my phone number. That being said, I am under no illusion that I have any answers for you. You have some serious stuff the wrestle with (once again I think of the story of Jacob wrestling an angelic figure- there is no consensus who that angel was- just an angel? God? Lucifer? - you have similar uncertainty, and yet you wrestle on..."
I really liked both the book and movie "Cloud Atlas" and I suspect you would too, even though I'm not a big reincarnation person. The premise is that a cluster of connected souls keep finding each other in a series of 6 interconnected plots over 600+ years- and the evolution each character undertakes (some for the better, others notsomuch) has ramifications on the future. It's worth googling the trailer to get a sense of if you'd like it or not.
DeleteAnyway, my point in bringing that movie up is there's a great quote that seems to really apply to your situation. It goes something like this.
"Our lives are not our own. Through our choices we are bound to others. In every crime, and each kindness, we birth our futures."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWnAqFyaQ5s (the trailer)
Thanks again Mach. I think the mail is not the best option. I was living on my own for 5 years in Providence but am back at home with my mom, and my mail is often already opened if my parents see it first.
ReplyDeleteI would suggest emailing an email address I use for junk mail and stuff....shaolinshinobi88@gmail.com send me an email and ill give you my phone number. I'll find a way to verify it's you before actually giving you my number but it will be a simple process - I can explain through email once you email me
If your not comfortable with this we can do something else. To be honest, there is something that freaks me out when I think about what it's going to be like to talk to you on the phone. I just really don't know exactly what to expect and I think it will be harder for me to be as open in the beginning. There is something about you that is very comforting though, but even still, I have a shyness about me. Based on my postings you would probably think otherwise, and in some ways I'm definitely not entirely shy.... but when it comes to actually talking about personal issues it's easy for people to go places with me where I just lock up and I just have to tell them to stop talking about it. So just please be respectful of me and don't be too pushy and prying.
DeleteI will email you from here on out. I will only try to reach you here if I am having technical difficulties. I will always contact you via this thread so if you are getting radio silence from me, then check back here.
DeleteWhere are you? What happened? Hope you are ok. Take care.
DeleteBy the way, when I say "parents" I don't mean they live together. I haven't seen my father in months and I do live with my mom but they are divorced. Although sometimes stuff gets mailed to his address and I can always tell its been opened. He rarely even tries to hide the fact that he opened it.
ReplyDelete