I have written before about how people with asperger's seem to be, if not loved, tolerated--
at least better than sociopaths or people from some of the other empathy challenged groups. I was thinking about this when I saw a youngster driving around with a "driver in training" sign on the car and a much older person in the passenger seat. The person was going much too slow for the conditions and later was causing a bit of a problematic traffic situation on an unprotected turn. For that sort of poor driving, people might usually honk or aggressively swerve around the slow driver, perhaps emitting a few profanities about getting off the road. But no one did that in this situation. Everyone waited patiently for them to finally find a gap big enough in oncoming traffic to make their turn safely. Why?
And does this same principle (whatever it is) have anything to do with why people don't find aspie's to be as morally offensive as sociopaths?
I can see a few reasons.
ReplyDeleteThe aspie comes off as feckless; he can't help it.
There are a few ways the sociopath can blow it.
1) He doesn't anticipate the disgust. E.g. an American in Thailand might pat a kid on the head. Similarly, I might remark to a mother/daughter pair, "it is amazing to think that she came out of you," because I just don't have the same feelings about things. Observers think, "the sociopath is disgusting."
2) He acts charming to get something. Then he takes it, impulsively, when the opportunity appears. Feelings of betrayal and hatred arise in the victim and observers, because the victim thinks, "he could & should have kept doing what I liked. He shouldn't have betrayed me." If you asked the sociopath why he deceived, he might say, "I gave the person what he wanted. Later, I saw an opportunity to take what I wanted, and I did."
3) The sociopath gets irritated by a person. There's stimulus -> rage -> plotting/scheming. The sociopath mostly thinks. He doesn't experience his feelings much. His response is to "act" either by doing something or thinking about what to do; it isn't to experience the feelings, question the feelings, question the assessment of the situation that led to the feelings. The sociopath might build weapons (or the equivalent) and stash them, anticipating a conflict; that's a way to "let off steam" by taking action.
Finally, in response to a trigger, the sociopath lashes out and executes a plan, perhaps using preplanned elements. Outside observers see the sociopath as being impulsive, vicious, premeditated and overreacting.
Feelings of horror or fear arise in observers and they decide the sociopath is very frightening, extreme and beyond redemption. It doesn't help that when they interview the sociopath after the stuff, he'll probably sound quite unemotional; observers will translate that into, "he not human."
"Different Equipment." The sociopath operates with entirely different equipment, and people don't 'get it.' Once they've observed and witnessed this type of cruelty, they know better and want nothing to do with it. It IS very frightening, how else could a person respond?
Delete"Once they've observed and witnessed this type of cruelty, they know better and want nothing to do with it. It IS very frightening, how else could a person respond?"
DeleteIf you have a problem with the existence of sociopaths, I have compassion for you. You live in this universe, the one that has sociopaths. You wish you were in the other universe - the one like this one, but without sociopaths. Until you come to terms with reality (sociopaths exist) you'll be unhappy. I suggest you avoid conflict with reality by accepting reality as it is.
Of course, you exist the way you do now only because of sociopaths - even if you don't have ANY in your family tree (an impossibility), you are using the internet to read this - and sociopaths played a role in bringing you the computer (google "Shockley"), the internet, etc. This moment was brought to you by sociopaths.
When I see sociopaths do shitting things, I view them with understanding and compassion.
E.g. I walk out of my apartment and I see two 17-year old blacks holding down a 7-year old white girl, raping her.
Their experience: they are having fun making her make loud noises and funny faces. They like being physically dominant. They like how it feels when they move their penises in and out of her holes. They've watched a bunch of porn and they finally get to act out their gang rape fantasies, and engage in some brotherly bonding with a white girl.
The little girl feels frightened. The blacks stink a lot. She's in pain, angry. She tries to resist but it doesn't work. She's confused about why the boys are hurting her and why nobody will help.
Before I shoot the rapists, I think, "if I were them, atom for atom, I'd be doing the sorts of things that they do. If only they had different minds, they'd not do this. I wish they could be happy and strong. Of course, I feel the same way for the little girl - I wish she could be happy and strong. Oh well, I'm so glad to be here today, able to help make the world a better place."
Bang, bang, bang, bang, bang!
Then it is time to comfort the little girl, starting by cleaning the brain off her.
One day she'll understand that the universe brought her into being, had her raped and so on. It all unfolded according to the laws of physics. It couldn't have been any other way. She never had a choice in any of it. Just as the rapists never had a choice in it, nor I had a choice in it.
Cup a hot cocoa and sw is all I need to unwind at the end of the day
DeleteEasy:
ReplyDelete1) The driver is in a way handicapped(actions are not deliberate), not able to do better. He is trying to conform, and we help him do so by our patience in oppsition to if he were an idiot that just doesn't know what he is doing or an asshole who deliberately breaks the rules.
2) Aspie -> handicapped(not deliberate) and no threat. Remedy: patience, we asume he will conform,
3) Sociopath -> evil, reckless, asshole(deliberate). Able to understand, but does not care. Can not be trusted. Will not conform. Poses great danger. This starts defence mechanisms, creates fear. Are we dealing with an animal/a predator? What have humans done with predators that have threatened us earlier? I guess that emotional response is programmed.
People don't like to be constantly questioning their safety and well-being. Not a pleasant way to live.
Deleteseeing "ME" in a recent documentary the main trait I noticed was that she looks very Jewish. Doesn't mean she is of course. But it's interesting that Jews are way overrepresented in aspies and austies, which are linked with sociopathy in various ways.
ReplyDeleteme has said she's religious...but it's interesting she's never talked about the Jewish element. Either about herself, or just because of the interesting connection with sociopathy.
Lol wtf? Lol
DeleteM.E. is simpily a beautiful woman and I love her VERY MUCH!
ReplyDeleteM.E. was wise not to teach J.R. High or High school. I can easily
see the unfortunate events of Danvers Mass. happening to M.E.
if she taught young adolecent males.
The boy developes a fanatsy "relationship in his mind. Maybe he talks
to his other teen friends about how sexy she is. The other boys laugh
but don't take it so seriously. They are extaverted and have some
"outlet."
The boy lives in the U.S.A. Western culture informs him that "sex"
is just another "entitlement." Heck, he's attentive to the media and
the web. He's aware of how loose "white sluts" are.
"A chicken in every pot!" "A pretty white girl in every bed!"
"What? She has a mind of her own? She doesn't want to? That's NOT
what I SEE on T.V., films and magazines. They're ALWAYS willing and
ready! SHE'S DISCRIMINATING AGAINST ME! I'll teach that white
tramp some respect!!! All I ever wanted was my fair share!"
M.E. is EXTREMELY lucky that she never taught boys that age.
If such a boy can make it to coledge without raping and murdering
his 9th grade teacher, he might just make it, or, at the very least
shoot up his school with an "impersonal" rapid fire weapon.
******************************************************************
By the way: M.E. for president! I would GLADLY have voted for her
over what we have NOW, and are liable to get in the future!
How would anyone know that an Asberger was driving the student vehicle to begin with, unless they knew the driver personally?
ReplyDeletePerhaps people were having a good day, not in a rush, just didn't care to honk and yell?
people are respectful of new, young drivers just learning.
DeleteAspies, God’s latest and greatest creatures, miracle of humanity, sent from above with a lot of love.
ReplyDeleteTreat them right.
Aspies, lovely, lovely, lovely bunch.
ReplyDeleteAnonymousDecember 16, 2013 at 8:25 AM...she LIKENED the situation to an Aspie. She never said the student WAS an Aspie. Learn to read what's actually there rather than what you perceive to be there.
ReplyDeleteI know the Anonymous December 16, 2013 at 8:25 AM personally. He got attention deficit, plus another deficit that I can’t say it here. It’s just not nice to say it aloud.
DeleteSay it!
DeleteHahaha. Morally offensive? Is this post for real? What's the worst thing people with aspergers do, say something rude? Be socially awkward? The idea of sociopaths arose from studying criminals, autism arose from studying kids who have trouble socializing. It should be obvious why one is less accepted than the other. Autism and sociopathy are very different disorders.
ReplyDeleteAspergers is perceived as lack of understanding of human emotions. Sociopathy is perceived as manipulation of human emotions. The first inspires tenderness/condescension/patience. The second inspires fear/defensiveness/anger.
ReplyDeleteObtuse behavior is considered forgivable if it was not committed with malicious forethought.
But in actual society there is hierarchy, and the definition of “obtuse behavior” varies based on your rank, position, goals, alliances … I am probably being devil’s advocate, but I see it all the time out there. Here, in this forum, if someone is obtuse- myself included- probably just being impulsive, since there is no actual tangible points, anyway.
DeleteAlso, open and guilt trip free forums are fun. A real socio never would come here!
DeleteI have to agree with you that the "open and guilt trip-free forums are fun". Probably explains why so many empaths hang out here, but I'm willing to bet there are a few real sociopaths.
DeleteI don't find anyone morally offensive.. except people who go out of their way to offend others in the name of righteousness. I think that bothers me because it comes from a place of insecurity. And so they're trying to prove how powerful they are by being 'offensive'. That doesn't connote power, it connotes powerlessness. Anyways yeah.
ReplyDeleteI mean there's nothing wrong with being 'offensive' because, the problem is with the perceiver who is offended. So in that way, no one is ever offensive and nothing can be offensive, the only offense occurs in your own mind and thats your own problem, no one elses.
DeleteWhat about masterbating into the basinette where your godchild's waiting to be baptized?
DeleteOffensive, or no?
I teach high functioning Aspie teens and they are not well tolerated due to their intelligence. The difference is that Aspie's have very low self esteem and so are ripe for bullying from neurotypicals. It appears that sociopaths have very high self esteem so that's one difference.
ReplyDelete
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