Is it possible that people with sociopathic traits might not necessarily like the way their life is going? And if so, is it possible for them to change? From a commenter, "I made myself believe I had changed, because I changed my behavior, but my thought process is the same":
So it occurred to me by accident (someone said it as a joke while I was trying to explain why I feel different) that I'm probably a sociopath. The thing is, going off of some of these "medical" articles, I can't be. But reading what other people say about themselves, It seems pretty accurate.
I DO THINK I feel some emotions, but I know for a fact I fake MOST. What's concerning me (the reason I started the conversation that led to that "joke") is that I'm not actually sure if my emotions that I THOUGHT were genuine are also bullshit. I know I've felt genuine remorse, I can remember 2 instances that I KNOW were real (because I didn't tell anyone about it, nobody was around to see my theatrics and I cried because I know I caused someone pain.) Both of these instances involve the same person. I think I feel some empathy, but I don't know if i actually do. Like I get it on an intellectual level, but I don't know that I actually FEEL IT. I know there have been some instances where I FORCE MYSELF to try to put myself in someone's shoes but it doesn't move me that. I have done a lot of grimy things "for fun" I spent a lot of time just playing games with people (basically every relationship).
Occasionally I would make people stay away from me. I'd tell myself I was doing this out of some type of kindness but if I think back honestly, it's more likely that they were too easy to control or too predictable. I created chaos nd manipulated situations to make them interesting "lets see what will happen if...." I don't like people who are cruel "for no reason" I do feel rage at things that I perceive as wrong or unjust, I do try to do "nice things" for strangers. But I'm not sure what my motivation is for it. I've always been a liar, but I hate liars. I've never been faithful in a relationship but I would get I THINK genuinely angry if someone Acted as though they suspected me of anything. I have "morals" but it's not based on emotion and they get real fuzzy when it suits me.
I found someone who was just like me. From the moment we met we knew it. I was in "a relationship" with him for 4 years and I was fascinated by him. by trying to destroy him. He's everything I hate and it made me NEED to be around him. I didn't love him. He didn't love me. He also hated me. But we got to be ourselves, we got to try to outwit each other. It was fun until it got boring. It's so fucking weird. idk you guys don't care lol.
The thing is, I feel like I want to FIX this disconnect. I'm not okay with this. I made myself believe I had changed, because I changed my behavior, but my thought process is the same. Idk what I'm hoping to get out of this. I actually DO want to be a good person. I WANT to feel bad about doing wrong, but I don't. "Shame" is an act, unless I'm embarrassed. I do think I love, but I think it's a very selfish variation because I do turn on people I "love" very viciously if they make me angry. But I also am vicious to those who hurt the ones I "love" so there's SOMETHING there. I have a baby now. I don't want to mess her up. Idk what to do.
So it occurred to me by accident (someone said it as a joke while I was trying to explain why I feel different) that I'm probably a sociopath. The thing is, going off of some of these "medical" articles, I can't be. But reading what other people say about themselves, It seems pretty accurate.
I DO THINK I feel some emotions, but I know for a fact I fake MOST. What's concerning me (the reason I started the conversation that led to that "joke") is that I'm not actually sure if my emotions that I THOUGHT were genuine are also bullshit. I know I've felt genuine remorse, I can remember 2 instances that I KNOW were real (because I didn't tell anyone about it, nobody was around to see my theatrics and I cried because I know I caused someone pain.) Both of these instances involve the same person. I think I feel some empathy, but I don't know if i actually do. Like I get it on an intellectual level, but I don't know that I actually FEEL IT. I know there have been some instances where I FORCE MYSELF to try to put myself in someone's shoes but it doesn't move me that. I have done a lot of grimy things "for fun" I spent a lot of time just playing games with people (basically every relationship).
Occasionally I would make people stay away from me. I'd tell myself I was doing this out of some type of kindness but if I think back honestly, it's more likely that they were too easy to control or too predictable. I created chaos nd manipulated situations to make them interesting "lets see what will happen if...." I don't like people who are cruel "for no reason" I do feel rage at things that I perceive as wrong or unjust, I do try to do "nice things" for strangers. But I'm not sure what my motivation is for it. I've always been a liar, but I hate liars. I've never been faithful in a relationship but I would get I THINK genuinely angry if someone Acted as though they suspected me of anything. I have "morals" but it's not based on emotion and they get real fuzzy when it suits me.
I found someone who was just like me. From the moment we met we knew it. I was in "a relationship" with him for 4 years and I was fascinated by him. by trying to destroy him. He's everything I hate and it made me NEED to be around him. I didn't love him. He didn't love me. He also hated me. But we got to be ourselves, we got to try to outwit each other. It was fun until it got boring. It's so fucking weird. idk you guys don't care lol.
The thing is, I feel like I want to FIX this disconnect. I'm not okay with this. I made myself believe I had changed, because I changed my behavior, but my thought process is the same. Idk what I'm hoping to get out of this. I actually DO want to be a good person. I WANT to feel bad about doing wrong, but I don't. "Shame" is an act, unless I'm embarrassed. I do think I love, but I think it's a very selfish variation because I do turn on people I "love" very viciously if they make me angry. But I also am vicious to those who hurt the ones I "love" so there's SOMETHING there. I have a baby now. I don't want to mess her up. Idk what to do.
FIRST!!!
ReplyDeleteYIPPIE!!! YIPPIE!!! YIPPIE!!!
~Vegas
We can not change but we can adapt
DeleteOP. yes it is possible to change. Sociopaths that have made profound changes need one thing. An important reason. You want your child to grow up without being messed up like us so you have one. I am living proof that you can change. We are not incapable of growth, we are incapable of becoming non sociopath. This is not in itself a bad thing. What I would suggest changing is your game plan.
ReplyDeleteAlways keep in mind that children learn by example. Your child will become what they see. Narcs destroy their children by saying one thing and being another. There is no reason you cannot be a good example. You are used to changing and adapting to be what you need correct? I raised 4 perfectly mentally healthy children. (not mine) In the case of children I have always been able to put their needs before my own. I had such a crappy childhood that my form of rebellion was to treat each child I meet as precious.
1. Be aware of your actions.
2. Play the long game instead of the short one.
3. Understand the child is not a toy, or a projection of you. It is separate little person. Cherish it. Interact with it.
This is the important part. Separate what you want from what your child needs.
How I keep on track is a simple filter. Run every action through the filter before you act (be honest) and you should be fine. Filter: Does this action harm anyone including me(short and long run. If answer is yes. Do not perform action. If no proceed to part two. DOes this action benefit anyone other than me. If yes proceed with action. If no, well run it by a person who has no stake in the outcome and see what they think about it. If they OK it then proceed. Practice this until you can make good (unselfish) decisions naturally.
Another good idea is to find an outlet for your worst impulses and game playing that is healthy. Just some things that worked for me. Best of luck and keep us updated.
Puppy you have a good heart don't call yourself a sociopath just because you're not perfect like me ;).
DeleteOnce you label yourself a sociopath you 1) set yourself up to be considered a threat and morally deficient OR 2)will insist that not all sociopaths are "bad." The problem is the word by definition denotes something negative. Not using it when its not fully applicable is better than using it and then changing its original meaning.
Puppy Basket and OP,
DeleteAs usual PP, what you post is absolutely correct and not to be argued with. But I have a question, nevertheless. What did you do [if it ever was found to be an issue], during the time you raised the four children, if/when you didn't pick up on their emotional needs accurately at all, because you just didn't have sufficient affective empathy to understand how they felt about something [in terms of the emotional weight ie. importance of that something, to them].
I know someone well. They've also had four children. By many people's assessment, that person would be regarded as an irresponsible parent. By mine, they've done the best they absolutely could, under the belief they weren't as bad at parenting as *their* parents - which would be true. However, it still meant this person could not pick up the fact they were often not 'doing right' by those children in terms of commitment [in time, for example. Or consistency]. All four are loved dearly and would be defended to the death. But still, they feel that parent "doesn't care enough". They wanted a "normal parent".
Seeing that, I ended up wondering whether it's a good idea for psychopathic people to parent at all, without either a massive dose of 'parenting skills' intervention, or else, having lots of very empathic extended family to 'pick up the slack' in that area.
So my question is this. Having, in the jargon, 'a specific lack of insight', how to even realise that what one regards as harm, is likely to be massively underestimating what other people regard as harm. How do you guard against that?
One might reckon "I'm doing great, I'm nothing like my f*ck-up of a parent" - but still come across as emotionally cruel and insensitive, to one's own child.
Last question, regarding your 'Filter' checklist. Was it you who posted the original version in SW a couple/few years back? Cause I found it in the archives, soon after I started seeing Short Shrink, [who smiled with relief that I was making efforts 8-/], and it's been working pretty well ever since. So if that was you, many thanks.
OP: the Filter - it works 8-)
OP. It is not at all bad to be psychopathic and you need not concern yourself. In fact being self-aware and psychopathic is a hundred times safer than being oblivious, for both you and anyone around you, as PP suggests.
It is quite likely that you think you are feeling emotions when in fact a lot of the time you're just aware of what emotions someone would appropriately feel in those circumstances. Because you've observed people for long enough. That does not mean you don't feel emotions at all, far from it. Yours may well be much more faint, so they are almost automatically dismissed, in passing. While it's not easy, you can be 'taught' how to 'trap' your own emotions, examine why they've just arisen, and then 'let them go on their way' - but then have the info: "Aha, I feel surprise! What surprised me exactly?" [a very simplistic example], to proceed appropriately. As in: "Hmm, a spider bit me, that's why. Is it poisonous? Should I google that just in case?" [I mentioned it was a simplistic example 8-)]. See what I mean?
And, regarding having a baby. The effects of oxytocin [produced during breast-feeding and after] works for a long time. 8-). It makes one feel very parental for years. Trust biology on this one. 8-)
KAT
Puppy Basket,
DeleteSorry, another minor question from a week or more ago [but you stopped posting].
Why did you say people with paranoid PD are poison and one should run if coming across one? Is it because the paranoia makes then more likely to be lethal, than any other PD?
Puzzled KAT.
Hey Kat. Surprisingly enough not getting emotional when helping people with an emotional situation is a stabilizing effect I have found. I have never found a problem with divining the emotional state of children because unlike adults they have yet been taught to hide it. Also they are more honest about what they are feeling although sometimes they have trouble narrowing down what they are actually feeling so that takes some questions. I am also very skilled in picking up emotional cues from body language and expression. I am the go to person for most of the people I know to come to for advice because I don't look at their problems through my own emotional baggage and I don't judge them. I can also tell when they are lying to me and or themselves so that helps cut through the BS and get to the solution.
DeleteYes I am the OP of the filter :) I can't take credit for it though as it was given to be by my AA sponsor.
People with Paranoid Personality Disorder are poison because yes they are absolutely dangerous, you cannot fix these people because if you ever disagree with them or don't support their delusions you become the enemy and they will NEVER as long as they live take you off the enemy list. I have never met anyone more manipulative or batshit crazy and I have lived with schizophrenics, Narcs, sociopaths and Bi-polars. Until you run into one you won't really understand the depth of their crazy though they come off as sweet stable people until triggered. That is another danger. They are harder to spot until they worm their way into your life and then they let the crazy hang out.
Very satisfying to hear the filter is working out for you. Sorry to be so hit or miss on posting I am job hunting with a dying vehicle right now. :(
PuppyBasket,
DeleteEasy bits first:
"Very satisfying to hear the filter is working out for you."
8-/ mostly, it is. Occasionally; not. 8-|
"have never found a problem with divining the emotional state of children because unlike adults they have yet been taught to hide it."
That seemed to be the problem in the situation I mentioned. The parent couldn't pick up that kind of stuff, because they self-medicated to an extreme degree, to reduce their reactive aggression. [At which point I'll stop, I'm talking about third parties and that's not OK re privacy 8-/] Only mentioned to illustrate that with the best will in the world, if one's not 'normal', being a parent may be problematic without guidance that maybe one'd need to be prepared to ask for?
Anyway, onto the main point. Sigh. The reason I asked about Paranoid PD is:
"Until you run into one you won't really understand the depth of their crazy though they come off as sweet stable people until triggered."
because irl I did [2 years ago], I think.
[After your response I read this:
http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/15/1/40].
Now the issue is I have quite high levels of hyper-vigilance myself; I realise my level of paranoia is higher than 'normal', so I recognised it in someone else. The problem is what to do, as they were indeed dangerous. The concern is that what they did to a friend, they've been doing for years previously and will carry on doing, since they get away with it. Not stuff like "he made me fall in love with him and then dumped me" [8-/ Sorry North not getting at you AT ALL. Just trying to convey legal severity].
Leaving a rabid dog slathering in the streets is proving ethically awkward. I would appreciate your measured response PP, 8-/, whenever you have time for another hit and miss post. I'm not asking for methods of termination BTW LOL. But the concern isn't decreasing over this two years. It's actually been very difficult to stand by and shrug my shoulders and say SEP. Maybe I should? So how to manage that, for instance?
Re another of your posts in another thread; I get asked for advice all the time by people, for the same reasons. The common sense, practical advice with no personal ax to grind. Which is ironic since I can't seem to give myself any sensible advice re the PPD issue. Except...hunt.
Trivial note: I can't resist this next word steal pun so possibly it'll evoke a groan with 'oh noo' internally at this point.
Being as the main topic is 'The Possibility of Change':
KAT who changed from XK
[I know [sigh], very corny] 8-/
"I realise my level of paranoia is higher than 'normal" Hm
DeleteThe person on the post mentioned empathy and guilt. From what I know these arent feelings sociopaths have, are they? Have you ever experienced them? Also I think the person sounded not really self aware ('I'm not actually sure if my emotions that I THOUGHT were genuine are also bullshit', 'I think I feel some empathy, but I don't know if i actually do'). Is lack of self awareness and clouded thought characteristic of a sociopath? Again I've heard no. What's your opinion/experience?
ReplyDeleteThis is addressed to Puppy Basket I accidentally posted it as another post, but anyone can say their opinion.
Delete"Is lack of self awareness and clouded thought characteristic of a sociopath? Again I've heard no. What's your opinion/experience?"
DeleteExperience is: yes. 'Clouded thought' is a very accurate description of: knowing something's not quite the same as others, knowing you can appear 'off' to others if you become too 'yourself' among them - but not knowing *what* makes things different. Cloudy thoughts occur because one overlays feelings and emotional responses within one's mind, which you've observed other people produce. You don't realise the significance of observationally learning them, because it's so automatic. How could someone know that was unusual, until it's pointed out explicitly?
Opinion regarding others'? Don't know.
When the clouded thoughts [ie. the overlays of learned emotional responses] are dissipated though - the sense of clarity is incredibly noticeable and never lost again. It makes a person a lot more coherent, objective and focused as well.
Re empathy and guilt: lots of cognitive empathy by default. Minimal affective empathy can be entirely mitigated by developing a set of ethics plus sympathy [to efficiently behave ethically towards others]. Guilt, remorse etc: are quite possible when reacting to one's own child. Not, however, particularly essential regarding others, if one has ethics and sticks to them.
KAT
Younger socios still have some level of empathy and emotion usually, the older we get the more detached we get. Guilt can be a non emotive form too. OP mentioned getting fuzzy on their own moral code and as that is all we usually have to judge ourselves by socios can get to "feeling" guilty if we betray our own code.
DeleteAnother question out of curiosity can a sociopath be manipulated by another sociopath? or a narcissist by a sociopath. For example make the narcissist dependent on them for narcissistic supply and then stop giving it.
Delete"can a sociopath be manipulated by another sociopath?"
DeleteThey seem to be doing it all the time in politics.
I think everyone, if not almost everyone, has faked emotions in their lives. Even "saints" don't feel for everyone all the time (that would be hell). Once again intentions are everything. I've tried faking emotions a little bit when I saw someone hurting, understood their pain ("intellectually" and ethically) but just didn't feel anything. More often I just sympathize with them, offer to help, and simply apologize for not being able to empathize more. People appreciate honesty a lot and they don't treat you like a freak just because you couldn't give them something most people could...if you're honest and admit your own shortcomings.
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ReplyDeletePsychopaths THINK emotions and they also THINK morals, and this make them almost normal. Not more dramatic than when certain zodiac signs FEEL instead of thinking (Cancer and Scorpio). Anybody who thinks Scorpio is inferior because of that? Scorpio is superior.
ReplyDeletePerhaps a main topic could be written about the interesting socio-feature "of being nobody but still behave like a star"? Few people understand the identity-emptiness of socios. They dont have a name, they dont have a personality, they have no sexuality etc; at least this is how many socios see it. But shouldn´t such people be VERY meek & confused? They don´t seem to be confused, not at all. And meek? How can such people be convinced that they are a superior life-form?
ReplyDeleteSo actors anon? That is what we are. The reason we think we are superior is we judge against emotional vs logical thinking. Most high functioning socios are high IQ, they tend to not understand the actions and thinking processes of the less gifted. Seriously I have had to explain to my friends and hubby 1000 times that people who might not have the math skills they do are not necessarily "wastes of space". They probably have unique skills of their own that we don't. Socios feel superior the same way Religious zealots do. By comparing apples to oranges. I think this way, you think that way one of us must be better than the other therefore I must be the superior one because.....REASONS! Then again Anon you are doing the same thing so.....
DeleteThe reason we are not meek is because fear is an emotion. We have no fear. Should we be confused because we have no core personality? Lolz why? Personality identity is an illusion anyway. It is just what you want it to be not matter if you are socio or non. Most people think they have personality A and then if you ask everyone around them they see them as personality b and then the people they work with see them as personality c. Your "personality/identity is in effect meaningless as everyone you meet is going to judge you through their own lens of experience and mental baggage/disorder anyway. What you call an identity is just memories and emotions connected to them causing you to repeat behaviors like a trained chimp. Since we don't have that we have more agency to act and therein lies OUR delusion that we are a superior lifeform.
We are stars. In a show were every one of you is bound by feelings. We are playing for the fun of it. You are playing because you have no choice.
DeleteWe are free, because there is nothing that can hold as back. There is no personality to guide us or restrict. What makes me superior is that I understand you fully, when you dont. Imagine a scientist and a caged mouse. When I look at my victims this is what I see. Mice. I like going to places like mountains or tall buildings just so I can view the world from on top. Look at all those people, small as mice, living their ordinary life. When I talk to people I feel like a scientist, doing experiments on them. It feels like pressing buttons, every button will give a specific reaction from the person. I’ve learned to use that keyboard very well.
-VN
I agree with you Puppy Basket.
DeleteBy superior I mean I am in control. At least that's the way it is when people dont know my ways.
-VN
Interesting. I feel exactly that way about **-*, as though he's a curiosity.
DeleteWe all give ourselves away by many tells (to quote A) and though you may not perceive your own self, patterns are nonetheless evident to others.
**-* has flexed to me as I am now but he has not adapted. His modus operandi and motivations are consistent and evident.
Yet are we not all made of the stuff of stars? Each capable of shining in ways that suit us and are enjoyable to us? That's wonderful to me: each of us the very same process as the Big Bang, coming on in our particular ways.
His way seems strange and hollow to me just as our ways are unseemly to you. Nevertheless, as abc (?) wrote it's ridiculous to think we don't do things we enjoy. That's not to say any human can't develop better practices! We ALL can! I definitely know that ;)
Feelings are a powerful resource.
"But shouldn´t such people be VERY meek & confused? They don´t seem to be confused, not at all. And meek? How can such people be convinced that they are a superior life-form?"
DeleteI think it's for precisely these reasons that power is the most integral driver for sociopaths. If it weren't, they'd be eaten alive. They wouldn't survive, it's as simple as that - resource contention is a consistent challenge for every life form in existence and human beings are no exception. We compete for resources every hour, minute even, of the day.
The power drive is essential to the success of this species subset.
Sorry, that's going well beyond my data... It's an hypothesis. There are lots of other adaptations sociopaths use to operate effectively in this social species of ours. Nevertheless, I think the power drive / superiority is almost as fundamental to them as normalisation is to all of us.
DeleteAnd that's ok. That's how it is.
Are you serious?
Deletereally
DeleteNorth emotions help to bond us, connect us . They are our tells. They are the reason we don't have to rely upon power to control and dominant. They aren't a weakness. They are what set us free. That being said I don't think you can compare sociopaths. I don't believe they lust after power and need it for survival. They need survival only to procure power. This is hard for me to explain right now. Something on the cusp but something...
DeleteIn the last post I meant I don't think you can compare sociopaths with nons. We are all flesh and blood but that is where it seems to end. I don't believe they lust for power because they "need" power to survive. I think that is comparing them where there is no comparison. They need to survive to procure power. We as nons need to compete or feel we need to compete because of sociopaths. Because of the mindset we have become accustomed to. Its not ours.
Delete"The reason we are not meek is because fear is an emotion. We have no fear."
DeleteThis is the biggest myth surrounding "sociopathy" - that they lack fear. Their "fearlessness" is just another mask which, when detected, turns into cowardice before you blink a second time. Real bravery & fearlessness comes from the heart. When you're most in need and afraid, its your heart which pushes you and aids you and helps you stand your ground. The real psychos sell their hearts for their false pride and pleasure and, as I've seen time & time again, become the worst cowards. If they turn around, clean up their slate, and become honest people, they would regain their lost sense of self & integrity and thus no longer be such cowards...but they opt for false pride.
Lest I be misunderstood: I'm NOT referring here to Puppy's definition of "sociopathy" where intentions don't matter, or the DSM's bogus diagnosis based on external "symptoms" without any regard for the inner state of the person. Many of you who call yourselves "sociopaths" are good-hearted people who struggling with bad genes and / or betrayal of some kind from loved ones. It's your hearts which give you your true strength and fearlessness, not the sociopathy.
A good-hearted person will stand their ground when necessary. A good-hearted "sociopath" will be even more fearless. A real psychopath will not be found in such moments because they are anything but "fearless."
So let's not make some sneaky, cowardly liar who's had it easy all their life think they're "fearless" because you - a good person who's doing the best they can with what they've got - think you're a sociopath.
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DeleteHas anyone seen the movie "Irrational Man", with Joaquin Phoenix and Emma Stone???
DeleteI watched it last night.:)
There was a funny quote in the movie:
"Philosophy is verbal masturbation".
Thoughts???
~Vegas
Kierkegaard was mentioned in the movie, as well.
DeleteThat's the 2nd time I've heard Kierkegaard mentioned, since M.E. made her Kierkegaard posts.:)
~Vegas
For the interested reader only:
DeleteMy thoughts on the basis of comparison between neurotypical and sociopath
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Delete"But shouldn´t such people be VERY meek & confused? They don´t seem to be confused, not at all. And meek? How can such people be convinced that they are a superior life-form?"
DeleteHow can you?
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DeleteNorth-
Delete"...nor understand them."
Seriously???
~Vegas
North-
DeleteDo you believe your "verbal masturbation", means you have a higher intellect than me???
~Vegas
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DeleteAnon 3:56:
Delete"North emotions help to bond us, connect us . They are our tells. They are the reason we don't have to rely upon power to control and dominant. They aren't a weakness. They are what set us free."
I kinda touched on this in my post but it warrants a comment of its own.
I really agree wholeheartedly with what you are saying. And actually reaching the point of understanding this and embracing it is a purely liberating experience. As you point out lucidly: competition is the psychopath's framing. We feel compelled to "compete" for a time... But how beautiful it is to realise and fall back to the person we are. Relationships are not competitions for us!! Totally agree with you.
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DeleteNorth-
DeleteI simply shared a quote from a movie, and asked for thoughts.
I did not say, that I agreed with the quote.
I definitely have more insight, as to who you are, though...
~Vegas
North-
DeleteI did not insult you.
I was not attempting provocation.
"Did you want a sociopath or two to create a little chorus against me? Fuck you."
What are you talking about???
"I was actually planning today to post how I heeded your warnings and was grateful for them. But you wanna fight huh. No problemo."
No, I don't want to fight with you.
What are you talking about???
Apparently, I should not share movie quotes that I find funny, and ask for thoughts...
YIKES!!!
~Vegas
Sorry Anon 3:56
DeleteI came back originally to make the response I made at 1:34, not to fight with Vegas.
North-
DeleteJoaquin Phoenix plays a philosophy professor in the movie, and that was his quote.
~Vegas
North-
Delete"I came back originally to make the response I made at 1:34, not to fight with Vegas."
Really???
~Vegas
North-
DeleteYou can delete your narcissistic rant, but the people here are intelligent enough to know, what just happened.
"For the interested reader only:"
I think I am married to a sociopath, and I am an "interested reader".
Although you have deleted your comment, stating I should "enjoy my own adventures", which I interpret to mean that you would like me to leave, the last I checked-this is not your blog.
North-This is "my adventure".
~Vegas
North-
DeleteI also did not appreciate you telling me, to "fuck off"...
~Vegas
North I read your post on your Blog-which I really enjoy-i have been reading it recently. There are so many points I agree with you on . I think your work is extremely important. This is a subject that is somehow practically nonexistent and yet applies to everyone. It is a gamechanger. I absolutely agree that evolution up to this point has brought us to a point of competition. We all survive because we learn how to play the game. I guess I am just looking more under the surface at things. Things bubbling underneath that I feel are important and are hard to capture or explain. I understand what you mean by sociopaths need for power. Their lack of understanding creates a chink in their armour. but I believe they make up for this with deception not necessarily an overexertion of power. Does that make sense?
DeleteThis deception has crept into every inch of evolution. I feel we have adapted to something we never even knew was there. We have been playing someone else's game. I know that in itself doesn't change reality but it does change the way one sees reality.
DeleteVegas hello- this is the anon 3:56 from the above post to north. I also chat with you from time to time. Yesterday I posted a question to you about Johnny Depp. ;-) I'm not sure exactly what the exchange was between you and north but I do want to say I feel her post for the interested reader only was intended as a response to My previous post to her. it was a direct response to theories I had posed to her. I don't want to intrude but I did feel compelled to make that a little more clear.
Delete"I guess I am just looking more under the surface at things."
DeleteYes, I think we are looking at things from a different viewpoint, and it's interesting to hear your thoughts. I have my own particular approach to understanding things - and it's a big enough task that I get lost inside my own perspective. It's a pleasure to see your angle too.
"This deception has crept into every inch of evolution. I feel we have adapted to something we never even knew was there. We have been playing someone else's game. I know that in itself doesn't change reality but it does change the way one sees reality."
You've piqued my curiosity with this. Are you able to elaborate?
"her post for the interested reader only was intended as a response to My previous post to her. it was a direct response to theories I had posed to her."
Yes, this is perfectly accurate. I simply deleted my comments here in response to your post and copied them there to make my own life more peaceful and productive.
I have updated it by quoting your full comment rather than just one line of it so the context is a bit clearer.
North-
Delete"and it's a big enough task that I get lost inside my own perspective."
This is why I "lose you".
"her post for the interested reader only was intended as a response to My previous post to her. it was a direct response to theories I had posed to her."
Yes, this is perfectly accurate."
You can always address, to whom your comment is specifically for, if that is indeed the case...
"I simply deleted my comments here in response to your post and copied them there to make my own life more peaceful and productive."
You deleted your comments, so everyone wouldn't know, who you really are. If you would like your life to be more peaceful and productive, maybe you shouldn't say the kinds of things you said to me, and then delete them.
"I have updated it by quoting your full comment rather than just one line of it so the context is a bit clearer."
I didn't think I needed to quote your full comment, as you had yet to delete them. Had you left them, the context would be quite clear.
Speaking of which-are you now saying the lines I quoted from your comments are a lie???
~Vegas
Anon @ 7:03-
DeleteHello.:) It is always nice chatting with you.:)
I didn't see your question about Johnny Depp-I will have to look that up.:)
Thank you for letting me know, that you thought North's post was for you.:) However, when that is the case, she uses the address of "Anon @...".
North didn't like my movie quote, took it as a personal insult for some reason, and proceeded to verbally attack me. I quoted some of it, before she deleted her posts.
I appreciate your attempt at mediation.:)
~Vegas
North-
DeletePS-My posts are still there.
Yours have been deleted.
The people here are intelligent enough, to decipher the truth. You can insinuate, that I am a liar, all you want...
~Vegas
North-
DeletePSS-It is a common practice, to use a portion of someone's comment-especially, if it is a long one.
Usually the poster doesn't delete their comment, so the full context can be seen, if necessary.
~Vegas
PSSS North-
DeleteI am sorry you are not getting your narc supply from this blog like you used to, or from your blog, but that isn't my fault.
~Vegas
North I guess what I mean is sociopaths knowingly adapt to nons and even if behavior is subtle or outright covert nons, I believe, would also adapt to sociopaths. The difference is we are unaware. We have for centuries been adapting to a group of people that are essential foreign to us.
DeleteVegas,
DeleteWhy not stop using the default Anon, just use the next option up and start using Vegas. It's getting visually confusing.
Anon, interesting and it does make sense. Symbiosis, perhaps. More generally speaking, I wonder how anti-social behaviour has historically influenced human conceptions of evil; it may be one of the conflations. And I wonder how smaller historical social groups have incorporated psychopaths into society. I have an irresistible thought of them being excellent shamans :p
DeleteNorth aspd behavior seems to be the basis for all of our perceptions of evil. Hell is to be separated from god. Hell is to be separated from oneself. Something missing. Replaced with a hive mentality?
DeleteI think of the ways I've unknowingly adapted to sociopaths-trying to please people who cannot be pleased. Mind games I was unaware of. A group with a very formulated agenda. I feel of course our history-our evolution has not only adapted but been moulded accordingly.
DeleteAnon @ 4:57-
DeleteI can completely identify, and agree with what you are saying.
~Vegas
Real bravery & fearlessness comes from the heart. When you're most in need and afraid, its your heart which pushes you and aids you and helps you stand your ground.
DeleteYou mean, like those Christians who refuse to recant their faith in Jesus and recite the Shahada?
The real psychos sell their hearts for their false pride and pleasure and, as I've seen time & time again, become the worst cowards.
You mean, like Muhammad? XD
If they turn around, clean up their slate, and become honest people, they would regain their lost sense of self & integrity and thus no longer be such cowards...but they opt for false pride.
You don’t understand the nature of sociopathy.
Lest I be misunderstood: I'm NOT referring here to Puppy's definition of "sociopathy" where intentions don't matter, or the DSM's bogus diagnosis based on external "symptoms" without any regard for the inner state of the person. Many of you who call yourselves "sociopaths" are good-hearted people who struggling with bad genes and / or betrayal of some kind from loved ones. It's your hearts which give you your true strength and fearlessness, not the sociopathy.
You *STILL* don’t understand the nature of sociopathy.
A good-hearted person will stand their ground when necessary. A good-hearted "sociopath" will be even more fearless. A real psychopath will not be found in such moments because they are anything but "fearless."
So let's not make some sneaky, cowardly liar who's had it easy all their life think they're "fearless" because you - a good person who's doing the best they can with what they've got - think you're a sociopath.
I am a good-hearted sociopath. We are legion. Put that in your pipe, and smoke it. :D
Alice in Wondrland
ReplyDeleteDo I understand this you have a child?
ReplyDeleteDo I understand this you have a child?
ReplyDeleteDo I understand this you have a child?
ReplyDeleteWho do U call 'Alice'?
DeleteThey may wish to answer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bnt8EyZ6lbM
ReplyDeletei promise you will have fun
Deletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bnt8EyZ6lbM
DeleteI watched. Beautiful. 8-) But do not play such games.
DeleteWe can not change but we can adapt
ReplyDeleteNow who's being pedantic 8-)
DeleteIts true that the often repeated "fact" about socios that "they lack fear" is untrue: the psychopath gets "focused" in dangerous situations, and fear is "pushed aside". Its not missing. And some claim that psychopaths compensate for their "missing identity" by (a genuine) belief that they are elite-people, even if there is absolutely nothing to prove such claim (no education, no money or fame etc)..
ReplyDeleteSociopaths do experience fear for example I fear being exposed and found out
DeleteI also fear bordum
DeleteI'm inclined to disagree, I'm not saying that sociopaths don't feel fear, I'm pretty sure every person does - but a sociopath is capable of rationalising said fear. A sociopath can see fear for what it is, a release of chemicals into the blood stream, an adrenaline shot which turns the stomach, dries the mouth, initiates shakes in the body.
DeleteOnce you can see it for what it is, fear is easily pushed aside and dealt with
Change happened for me...in the complete opposite way. I see myself as an extreme empath, so much so that it is greatly adventageous, but often at a large cost. True empathy can be crippling, and can make it difficult to do what is necessary in certain situations. Seeking insight from sources like this post has allowed me to tip the scales when needed. I also have a sociopath friend who has helped me as well. And yes he is a friend to me even if he may not see me the same. I may be a source of entertainment but he also knows I can maintain such a mutaual understanding and "arrangement". If one day he grows bored of me, he will be missed, but I would understand it is just part of who he is. In the meantime he helped me become a more functional person by being a little more like a sociopath. By putting myself completely in his shoes I can view people more objectively if needed. This wouldn't be possible without having this relationship with my friend.
ReplyDelete